Adding a Reason to Skip the Breeding Pits

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Doctornull
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Adding a Reason to Skip the Breeding Pits

#1 Post by Doctornull »

Quotes are from posts starting on page 205 of this thread: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showth ... id=3457973

Clipping by request of DarkGod.
Not to mention that the narrative and the gameplay in that scenario are completely disconnected. From the standpoint of the narrative, it's presented as this terribly difficult choice between committing a culture that's been unfairly - over throughout all of history to extinction or letting the vagiants suffer horribly and terribly for years to come. But, looking at it as a game, if you kill them all you get huge XP, the standard drops from bosses, and stop getting - over by endless orc-patrols on the world map; no such benefits are given for you having them live. There's no unity to that section of the game.
Discuss.
Last edited by Doctornull on Tue Dec 31, 2013 5:32 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Revanchist
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#2 Post by The Revanchist »

If I recall, that... particular... zone is 100% optional. I agree that there are many benefits to travelling it, but those can realistically be passed over.

I happen to (sort-of-)like the current setup. You want to take advantage of these defenceless Orcs, go ahead. Commit genocide. Doom an entire race to fuel your own greed. I don't think it should be morally easy to go through it. After all, it's a pretty disgusting tale throughout, and what better way to end it than as a monster hunting monsters? Evil unto evil, no?


Ultimately, I don't know if I want it changed. The Orcs are a race like the Dwarves, Humans or anyone else, and making them... less "human" to make it easier to kill them is just cheap.

IvenGray
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#3 Post by IvenGray »

An achievement for mercy on the orcs? One gets it if he decides to leave them alone after reading all the lores in the pits.
Requirements:
-Got all the lores in the pit.
-Killed fewer than X(10?) orc youth/baby in total, and 0~3 after you learned the story.
-Left orc mothers alone.
-Finished the campaign(or reach High Peak).

Then Aeryn did the dirty job.

The Revanchist
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#4 Post by The Revanchist »

Could we take it further?

Assuming the criteria you outlined were met, and Aeryn survived, she talks with you about it. Then you're offered a choice.

a) Let her destroy the Breeding Pits.
b) Stop her. (Attack)

----------

Or is it a requirement that one of you die? If so... sorry.

IvenGray
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#5 Post by IvenGray »

The Revanchist wrote:Could we take it further?

Assuming the criteria you outlined were met, and Aeryn survived, she talks with you about it. Then you're offered a choice.

a) Let her destroy the Breeding Pits.
b) Stop her. (Attack)

----------

Or is it a requirement that one of you die? If so... sorry.
Unless one takes the initiative to talk with Aeryn before reaching high peak, the genocide happens. The genocide can be conducted by the people of Sunwall even if Aeryn were killed (by player). And it should take place before or simultaneously with the potential destruction of Sunwall (if the mage is not stopped on the volcano).

The Revanchist
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#6 Post by The Revanchist »

IvenGray wrote:
The Revanchist wrote:Could we take it further?

Assuming the criteria you outlined were met, and Aeryn survived, she talks with you about it. Then you're offered a choice.

a) Let her destroy the Breeding Pits.
b) Stop her. (Attack)

----------

Or is it a requirement that one of you die? If so... sorry.
Unless one takes the initiative to talk with Aeryn before reaching high peak, the genocide happens. The genocide can be conducted by the people of Sunwall even if Aeryn were killed (by player). And it should take place before or simultaneously with the potential destruction of Sunwall (if the mage is not stopped on the volcano).
So you would have to lose your (valuable) ally just to protect a race of warmongers? I like it, personally.

Doctornull
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#7 Post by Doctornull »

Edit: nevermind, carry on!
Last edited by Doctornull on Tue Dec 31, 2013 5:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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The Revanchist
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#8 Post by The Revanchist »

In what way do they warrant fixing, then?

I don't see how they're broken in the first place.

I apologize for the topic having been departed from.

PureQuestion
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#9 Post by PureQuestion »

They're broken in that the story is a moral dilemma that isn't reflected in the gameplay. There is nothing but benefit to the extinction of the orcs.

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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#10 Post by The Revanchist »

I think the Orcs would beg to differ. Not that anyone would listen...

PureQuestion
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#11 Post by PureQuestion »

There is nothing but gameplay benefit the extinction of the orcs.

The Revanchist
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#12 Post by The Revanchist »

PureQuestion wrote:There is nothing but gameplay benefit the extinction of the orcs.
I thought you meant in-universe benefit. Which is where I was referring to.

What is there to do, really, to make it less desirable from a pure loot perspective, though? I can't think of a single way to make it less viable.

tylor
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#13 Post by tylor »

What about, if you spare orc mothers, then in final fight orcs ally with you against sorcerers?

Doctornull
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Re: Fixing the Breeding Pits (ideas posted from SA thread)

#14 Post by Doctornull »

Ah, now I see what's going on. People are latching on to the first quote and only seeing that issue rather than the larger and more problematic one.

I'll start a new thread with the other issues, carry on.
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Stition
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Re: Adding a Reason to Skip the Breeding Pits

#15 Post by Stition »

What?! people have a problem with the genocide of orcs? They're an abomination, the loot is just a bonus for their extinction. It's a kill or be killed scenario.
I imagine it's the same thing with the adventuring parties. Either it's you that attack them, trying to steal their loot, or it's the other way around.
You could make a similar, but less baby killing, arguement for the adventuring parties.

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