ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2013 10:01 pm 
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Wayist

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:25 pm
Posts: 16
I'm having a lot of fun with this class. Sorting through a level's worth of stomach contents can get tedious, as others have pointed out, but I'm not really sure design-wise how to better streamline/automate this process. It would be nice if you could somehow tick-mark all the things you want to digest or excrete or save for regurgitation. And there should probably be a limit on the number of creatures you can hold before they start being excreted automatically (is there already? didn't appear to be).

I did encounter a funny bug when I regurgitated a gwelgoroth from the Derth attack. When it died I got the "cool hero" achievement and the end dialog for clearing the town. I haven't tried but I suspect this could happen with other things, like regurgitate Ben and get the curse lifter dialog when he dies. Obviously most people are going to digest bosses -- I'd consider making that automatic.

This will be a lot of fun to see how things go in mid/late game.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:02 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
So, uh. Digestion gained golem is weird? Got it at level 18. Golem is level 18 with -6 stat points, 20 class points, 14 generic points, and a free category point. I rather think this isn't quite working as intended :P

Also, golems have a talent called armor configuration? Apparently? Not sure if this is a glutton issue or base game, or maybe one of the other addons I forgot to turn off, but at tlvl 1 it's giving me -3 armor (that is, a penalty of three), -10% armor hardiness, and increase my chance to get critted by 4%. Little strange.

E: And, uh. Is regurgitate supposed to damage the player? I guess so, since the range increases with tlvl, too...

E2: Something not mentioned in the regurgitate/devour/regurgitate loop noted earlier in the thread: The stat scaling keeps stacking. Though they do, fortunately, respect the 100 point cap on base stats (though... I wonder if that's true in the infinite dungeon...). I'm currently looking at a regurgitate recursion golem (from the golem graveyard) who has base 100 for all its stats >_>

Gonna' have to try this with the alchemist golem once (if) I manage to nab a way to bring it back to life.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 7:54 am 
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Thalore

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:58 am
Posts: 152
Was going to report the Armor configuration issue as well - it appears to be a base game issue as I have no other addons on (I assume it's a hidden counterpart to the golem armour skill that the alchemist gets, and is how the bonus is applied to the golem). I would guess that the issue is a conflict with armour training, as there may be something making sure they don't stack.

As for the class in general, it's fun, if completely broken as everyone else has noted :P
You also get way too many skills, it starts to become a chore to sort though them, as well as making cooldowns almost irrelevant since you have so many things you can throw at enemies. Some way of limiting what skills you can learn/have currently available would go a long way to making the class more balanced and manageable, although I'd suspect it would not be easy to code.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 1:34 pm 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
Would, uh. Would it be possible to give regurgitate that little AoE indicator whatsit? Like with most ball-type talents? It'd be nice if it were, would make aiming the thing much easier. And help me stop blowing myself up with a 500+ damage nuke, ahaha.

Another minor oddity with regurgitate is that its range scales with effective talent level. I'm definitely guessing that's intended, but for everyone except highers a range >10 is kinda' wasted, heh. And with a cat point invested (and everyone and anyone is going to put a cat point in that tree, since that means you get access to up to tlvl 7 talents >_>), regurgitate caps out at a range of 12. Not sure if it's worth changing the range to raw or not.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 05, 2013 6:27 pm 
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Cornac

Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:49 am
Posts: 33
hollower wrote:
And there should probably be a limit on the number of creatures you can hold before they start being excreted automatically
My suspicion is that people would be very displeased with this.

hollower wrote:
I did encounter a funny bug when I regurgitated a gwelgoroth from the Derth attack. When it died I got the "cool hero" achievement and the end dialog for clearing the town. I haven't tried but I suspect this could happen with other things, like regurgitate Ben and get the curse lifter dialog when he dies. Obviously most people are going to digest bosses -- I'd consider making that automatic.
I don't think I can fix this bug. That would probably entail removing those triggers, which I assume are set on the specific enemies. And I don't like the idea of automatic digestion.

Frumple wrote:
So, uh. Digestion gained golem is weird? Got it at level 18. Golem is level 18 with -6 stat points, 20 class points, 14 generic points, and a free category point. I rather think this isn't quite working as intended :P
Learning golemancy is probably OP anyway. I'll disable it.

Frumple wrote:
Also, golems have a talent called armor configuration? Apparently? Not sure if this is a glutton issue or base game, or maybe one of the other addons I forgot to turn off, but at tlvl 1 it's giving me -3 armor (that is, a penalty of three), -10% armor hardiness, and increase my chance to get critted by 4%. Little strange.
Armour Configuration and Self-Destruct can no longer be learned in 0.0.7.

Frumple wrote:
E: And, uh. Is regurgitate supposed to damage the player? I guess so, since the range increases with tlvl, too...
Yes, that's intended.

Frumple wrote:
E2: Something not mentioned in the regurgitate/devour/regurgitate loop noted earlier in the thread: The stat scaling keeps stacking. Though they do, fortunately, respect the 100 point cap on base stats (though... I wonder if that's true in the infinite dungeon...). I'm currently looking at a regurgitate recursion golem (from the golem graveyard) who has base 100 for all its stats >_>

Gonna' have to try this with the alchemist golem once (if) I manage to nab a way to bring it back to life.
Fixed in 0.0.7.

Theyleon wrote:
Some way of limiting what skills you can learn/have currently available would go a long way to making the class more balanced and manageable
Added in 0.0.7.

Frumple wrote:
Would, uh. Would it be possible to give regurgitate that little AoE indicator whatsit? Like with most ball-type talents? It'd be nice if it were, would make aiming the thing much easier. And help me stop blowing myself up with a 500+ damage nuke, ahaha.
Done.

Frumple wrote:
Another minor oddity with regurgitate is that its range scales with effective talent level. I'm definitely guessing that's intended, but for everyone except highers a range >10 is kinda' wasted, heh. And with a cat point invested (and everyone and anyone is going to put a cat point in that tree, since that means you get access to up to tlvl 7 talents >_>), regurgitate caps out at a range of 12. Not sure if it's worth changing the range to raw or not.
I made the range high so players can avoid regurgitating on themselves. :P

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:15 am 
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Thalore

Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 9:58 am
Posts: 152
Another potential issue - I ran into a Glutton rare, and of course ate it. When I digested it, I got +1 digest, even though I was at 5/5, due to the category multiplier. This would of course raise digest enough that the next rare I ate would potentially be able to get me to 7 if it had a high enough level. Given how that works, with enough glutton rares you could get a rather high digest, and thus be able to get rather high levels on other skills. Probably only a large issue in the ID rather then the normal game, but thought I'd mention it.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:33 am 
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Cornac

Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:49 am
Posts: 33
Theyleon wrote:
Another potential issue - I ran into a Glutton rare, and of course ate it.
Enemies can no longer be Gluttons in 0.0.7.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 6:33 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
Thought if you're still thinking for something for gastric acid to do, now that its talent gain part has been rolled into digest: Let it give digest a minor regen boost while digesting (.1-.2 per tlvl, nothing large) and a small direct heal when excreting (10-20/tlvl, again, fairly small since you can stack up quite a few things in your belly.). That'd make it a general passive boost to the stomach related talents instead of just regurgitate. Maybe a little boring, but it's a thought.


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:00 pm 
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Wayist

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:25 pm
Posts: 16
My life is now complete!


Attachments:
bunnypocalypse.png
bunnypocalypse.png [ 192.91 KiB | Viewed 1596 times ]
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:16 pm 
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Thalore

Joined: Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:31 pm
Posts: 186
Please tell me those work. Do they do anything outside of that dungeon?


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:53 pm 
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Wayist

Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 7:25 pm
Posts: 16
Amphouse wrote:
Please tell me those work. Do they do anything outside of that dungeon?

Alas, not really. Bunnypocalypse works in that zone, requiring one of the cute bunnies to be in view, it raises a lua error but does indeed transform the bunny into a friendly randboss. Haremageddon (summon zombie bunnies) doesn't work at all.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:53 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
The real sad thing is that they're both equilibrium talents :cry:

Skeleton glutton ate all those druids for nothing :(

... well, except the blood boil, I guess.


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:06 pm 
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Halfling

Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 6:06 am
Posts: 112
So far I love this class. I'm tempted to ask that weapons are made for it like a knife and fork. The large array of talents to choose from in a fix just keeps getting bigger Only problem(s) I've had so far is an error popup on using enemy talent Phase Door and a very small number of other talents not doing anything when I use them. The second problem could be due to area the talent is used. I'm still fairly knew to the game. >.>
(Version 6b)


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 9:29 pm 
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Yeek

Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2011 5:03 am
Posts: 10
My version 0.0.6b winner, Grutton, the master of assimilation: http://te4.org/characters/6188/tome/8d5 ... 5e0dd1465c

One thing I want to suggest now that a total skill cap has been incorporated is a way to permanently unlearn (and never learn again) skills you wouldn't want for a build. I'd hate to keep learning howl, shriek, and summon from rares just because I kept removing them from my skill set.

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:01 am 
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Cornac

Joined: Sun Jan 20, 2013 8:49 am
Posts: 33
Glutton 0.0.7 has been deployed!

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