sajberhippien wrote:astralInferno wrote:Nevuk wrote:Would that help? (Would mean you can get golem to 10/5 if you really tried, not sure how well they scale).
TERRIFYINGLY.
you probably don't want to do this on purpose. ;P
Seconded. Not only is it completely over the top, its also bad design in that it makes the standard golemancy strictly worse than advanced golemancy.
I'm gonna be frank: Overall I think this mod has started with some faulty assumptions about both the power level of the alchemist, the reasons its considered a problematic class, and the methods with which to combat this.
The alchemist is a bit weak, but its not so weak to be unplayable or so thst all the talents need buffs. There has been insane winners of alchemists, after all.
It's a fool's quest to try to balance something based on its performance in madness, when one doesnt have much in the way of insane or madness wins. I'm not saying you can't make a great mod or that you're a bad player (heck, ive never even beaten nightmare!) but that its hard to balance something without knowing the meta. Aim for balancing around nightmare, as that's the difficulty you seem most experienced with.
That's fair. I'm actually not trying to make it better at insane - I'm using "if it's stronger at insane than sawbutcher, there's a problem" as a balancing guideline, but I have literally 0 experience with modding tome before this. My experience with madness is that if you don't have an absolutely broken defensive ability, the class probably isn't viable (I'm pretty sure an alchemist with a 3x buff to its damage numbers is still going to be unable to complete madness, and nothing has been touched that far). I've mostly been play testing on nightmare, and if it's literally thoughtless bomb spamming I do go and change some numbers, but I've had less time the last couple of days to do it due to some obligations and being more interested in the newer tree.
I'm also definitely not claiming it's balanced currently- that's now my #1 priority, to make it more balanced, but I need feedback from people on that. (Note that this version of throw bombs may actually do less damage under a lot of circumstances, as explosion expert scales less, which is why I've left some of the more ridiculous early numbers in place). I'm mostly happy with the actual function of the class now.
Also, I have no issues admitting I'm wrong on a balance issue - 3x damage channel staff was way over the top, and housepet correctly identified the real problem - it doesn't make sense to have it as a generic talent at all. This version of channel staff is probably technically weaker than vanilla channel staff, but you don't need 10 generics to get it there.
I will admit it did start out as "just buff everything", in a kind of memeish fashion, but most of the changes since like... 0.2.0 have been to things I think are conceptually problematic - like golem being unable to use his physical abilities in melee range, or body of fire being yet another aoe damage spell on a class that already has too many (and was a mostly useless ability on top of that). No longer consuming gems was due to conversations in chat with Minmay and others about what they most disliked about the class, the resistance penetration was added because of similar conversations. Overall Alchemist is still probably buffed, but it needs a lot of playtesting with things like throw bomb being totally rescaled.
There are things I'm unsure of like lowering the cast period of refit golem, but I frankly don't see the purpose of smoke bomb without that sort of change (the buff to golem hp on revival is probably too much, but I feel silly changing only 1 fairly small thing for a balance patch unless there's also some bugs). Really, I'm unsure of pretty much all the numbers - a bunch of their skills just had fundamentally lower damage values than most other classes, with less utility to offset it, so I buffed them, but that may not be necessary.
I've beaten the game with alchemist back when it was a far weaker class (yes, really, back when it had heat), but I was kind of disappointed to come back to the game years later and see other problematic classes get majorly overhauled (archer) while alchemist, one of the earliest classes, was relatively untouched on what made it really problematic(to me, the problem is that it's a one trick pony - almost useless outside of throw bomb). Plus it gives me some hands-on experience with another programming language.
Now that I am having active feedback, I will throw out an idea in the thread and see if it's too far if I really have no idea before just slapping it in. (I will say the weapons training suggestion was made in view of the 1.6.0 changes, where it'd strictly be a buff to golem's weapon damage, not to its physical power). I may still add thick skin to life tap, but that's more because I think lifetap is a kind of odd ability. Jewelcraft is a unique beast, and not as ridiculous as I first thought, though I'm sure the numbers need tweaked (initially I had it at blocking gem power per instance instead of gem power *1.5 but I was unsure how useful it would really be to block at most 95 damage per instance for 4-8 turns, for a cat point and a lot of talent points). I personally find it easier to start too high and tune down.