Wyrmic scaling issues

[anonymous000]

Apart from useless talents and the breaths, to me one of the major problem about Wyrmics is that, being primarily a fighter class, they are doing a very disappointing job at melee. They are like a crippled bulwark/berserker without all the sustain/passive/extra melee talents to make melee interesting.

I think they need a major overhaul for their melee mechanisms. Like (just for brainstorming only, I do not think it through enough here):

1. Enabling them to wield a shield and a two-hand weapon at the same time to make them accessible to Shield Offense and Two-hand Assault without switching weapon sets

2. New melee trees that requires mindstars, by holding mindstars you can channel your mindpower more easily and this gives you more affinity with draconic power, letting you grow claws/wings/tail/etc. The attacks would be more about nature damage/manaburning/arcane disruption/dealing small area AoE at melee range. Damage-wise it should be inferior to shield+two-hand weapons but the good point is more utility, decent against non-arcane enemies too

3. More mobility, having only Lightning Speed seems not enough

4. More sustains and passives

[Razakai]

A 'Draconic Strength' talent allowing 2h weapons to be wielded in 1h would be an interesting niche.

[HousePet]

Been having fun with talents.
Tell me what you think.

Drake Body
Drake Strength: passive. Increases strength and knockback resistance. At 5 allows you to weild a shield with a two handed weapon.
Drake Scales: passive. Increases armour and stun resistance.
Bellowing Roar: Change to scale with constitution. Improves the strength of all breath talents.
???

Desert Drake
Swallow: Change to physical damage?
Ember Scales: Increases lite radius, burns adjactent enemies and leaves a trail of flames. Shield block can block fire damage. Scale with armour.
Devouring Flame: Change to inflict burning and fire on the ground. Scale with willpower.
Sand Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Desert Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Burrow: Bumps attacks also knock enemies aside.
Drake Hunger: Free heal/equil restore on kills. Reduces cooldown on Swallow. (Nom)
Quake: Add disarm to enemies. Scale with strength.
Fire Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Storm Drake
Claw Dance: Circular attack.
Static Field: Random mini chain lightnings. Shield block can block lightning damage. Scale with armour.
Lightning Speed: Convert attack damage to lightning.
Wing Buffet: Scale with strength.

Storm Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Flyby Slash: Leap Attack that dazes and then lands you nearby.
Tornado: Make it move faster. Scale with willpower.
Cloud Seer: Increases sight range, lowers minimum equilibrium and gives blindness resistance.
Lightning Breath: Change to scale with constitution. 100% daze chance.

Aquatic Drake
Ice Claw: Add iceblock pierce.
Fog Cloud: Cloud of blinding fog. Can trigger Water Dweller.
Icy Skin: Replace bonus armour with slows melee attacks. Shield block can block cold damage. Scale with armour.
Water Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Aquatic Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Water Dweller: Increases life and equilibrium regeneration while in water.
Ice Wall: Freezes enemies caught in the wall.
Flood: Drowning AOE. Can trigger Water Dweller. Scale with willpower.
Ice Breath: Change to scale with constitution. 100% freeze chance.

Marsh Drake
Acidic Spray: Scale with willpower.
Root Lash: Basically Bone Grab but with a nature damage weapon smack.
Corrosive Mist: Change to sustain, reduce radius and add evasion. Shield block can block acid damage. Scale with armour.
Venomous Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Marsh Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Natural Vigor: Increases maximum life/stamina and life/stamina regeneration.
Dissolve:
Venomous Quills: sustain. Adds nature damage to your attacks and when you are hit in melee. Scale with willpower.
Corrosive Breath: Change to scale with constitution. Change 25% disarm to 100% armour corrosion.

Wild Drake - granted instead of fungus by Myssil. requires level 10
Prismatic Slash:
Nature's Defender: passive. Grants spell save, arcane resistance and damage shield penetration. Shield block can block arcane and nature damage. Scale with armour?
Chromatic Fury:
Antimagic Breath: Manaburn damage and dispel. Scales with constitution.

Blood Drake - Granted locked by consuming the Corrupted Heart. Require level 10. Ppassive blight resist on all talents. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and life!
Blood Spring: Melee attack that causes blood to flow around the victim, hrting enemies and healing you over time.
Bone Scales: sustain. Any damage hit above a % of your maximum life, reduces the damage to that amount and explodes bone shards around you, inflicting bleeding. Shield block also blocks blight damage. Scales with armour.
???
Sanguine Breath: Blight and disease infliction, scales with constitution.

Blink Drake - Granted locked by a drop from Rantha the Abomination. Require level 10. Passive temporal resist on all talents. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and paradox!
Blink Claw: active. Teleport next to target creature with a melee attack that inflicts temporal damage over time.
Phased Wyrm: sustain. Gives flat damage reduction against all types. Reduces debuff duration. Shield block can now block temporal. Scales with armour.
Time Sink: active. Drains time from target area, slowing affected creatures, doing temporal damage and hasting you. Scales with willpower.
Temporal Breath: Temporal and stat reduction, scales with constitution.

[Suslik]

@HP
looks very interesting but let's finish mindslayers first ._.

[anonymous000]

Good ideas abound but so are the so-so ones too.

1. I like the Wild Drake/Blood Drake/Blink Drake trees, but I am not really sure about the Wyrm trees as they seems too much. There are also quite a number of relatively useless talents. I suggest trimming down the trees, keeping the original Sand/Fire/Ice/Lightning/Acid trees and adding new trees like "Advanced Draconic Combat" tree to keep the extra talents

2. I really like the the talents that grant you additional element to block, but I suggest putting the fire/ice/lightning/acid ones into a new tree (Wyrmic scale) to free up some space if you are going to trim down the trees. Scaling with armour seems weird to me as this means that you get better at channeling your draconic power by putting on a heavier armour, suggest scale them with willpower

3. The breaths: Not really sure about the purpose of scaling them with constitution

Colored in green refers to the talents which I suggest to improve
Coloered in red refers to the talents which I suggest to remove

Drake Body
Drake Strength: passive. Increases strength and knockback resistance. At 5 allows you to weild a shield with a two handed weapon. (if shield + two handed is going to be a niche for wyrmics it might be better to give it since level 1; and unlike classes like Arcane Blade/Temporal Warden, Wyrmics’stats are focused on str/will/con so I don’t think +str is that useful for Wyrmics. I suggest this: When you mind crit you +fire/ice/lightning/acid damage to melee attacks for x turns, while physical crit cause a small AOE of nature damage. The use of Breath talents put this into cooldown. This is to encourage better stat planning instead of dumping all stats into str/con/wil, and discourage excessive use of breaths)

Drake Scales: passive. Increases armour and stun resistance. (and also knockback resistance)

Bellowing Roar: Change to scale with constitution. Improves the strength of all breath talents. (don’t really see the point to have it improve the strength of breath talents, also suggest moving it to desert drake/desert wyrm/sand drake/fire drake tree as this tree seems to be more about passives)

(Suggest moving Cloud Seer here)

(Drake Mind: passive. Increase confusion resistance, fear resistance, and crit multiplier for mental crit)

Desert Drake
Swallow: Change to physical damage (that and gain HP and stamina, and reduce equilibrium when hits. Extra bonus of the aforementioned effects when killing enemy with it. Most of the time Swallow is only a finishing move, this is to make the talent more useful in normal circumstances)

Ember Scales: Increases lite radius, burns adjactent enemies and leaves a trail of flames. Shield block can block fire damage. Scale with armour.

Devouring Flame: Change to inflict burning and fire on the ground. Scale with willpower.

Sand Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Desert Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Burrow: Bumps attacks also knock enemies aside. (knocking back enemies seems always a bad skill for fighters. Suggest bump attack shatters armor and magical/physical shields, also pin enemies)

Drake Hunger: Free heal/equil restore on kills. Reduces cooldown on Swallow. (same as Swallow? If it is a sustain/passive, Wyrmic already has great healing ability from Fungus)

Quake: Add disarm to enemies. Scale with strength. (suggest removing the knockback)

Fire Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Storm Drake
Claw Dance: Circular attack. (covered by Death Dance)

Static Field: Random mini chain lightnings. Shield block can block lightning damage. Scale with armour.

Lightning Speed: Convert attack damage to lightning. (or add lightning damage/ small AOE when the effect ends with a melee attack?)

Wing Buffet: Scale with strength. (Suggest also dazes enemies for 1-2 turns to make knockback actually a lifesaver instead of just benefiting the casters. Extra damage bonus if the enemies are knocked back to a wall.)

Storm Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Flyby Slash: Leap Attack that dazes and then lands you nearby.

Tornado: Make it move faster. Scale with willpower. (suggest removing it, its knockback is often useless as I find the only circumstance you want to knock enemies back is when you get surrounded, while Tornado only knockback in a line)

Cloud Seer: Increases sight range, lowers minimum equilibrium and gives blindness resistance.(suggest making it a passive, also x% chance to detect hidden/obstructed/invisble enemies within sight range, check at each enemy)

Lightning Breath: Change to scale with constitution. 100% daze chance.

Aquatic Drake
Ice Claw: Add iceblock pierce. (still too plain for my taste, just a stronger bump attack with ice damage. Don't see the need to keep it)

Fog Cloud: Cloud of blinding fog. Can trigger Water Dweller. (Blind covered by Sand Breath)

Icy Skin: Replace bonus armour with slows melee attacks. Shield block can block cold damage. Scale with armour.

Water Breath: Change to scale with constitution. (too many breaths already)

Aquatic Wyrm - locked, requires level 10

Water Dweller: Increases life and equilibrium regeneration while in water. (not useful in most circumstances)

Ice Wall: Freezes enemies caught in the wall. (add ice damage)

Flood: Drowning AOE. Can trigger Water Dweller. Scale with willpower. (not really sure about add another AOE as we already have quite a lot)

Ice Breath: Change to scale with constitution. 100% freeze chance.

Marsh Drake
Acidic Spray: Scale with willpower.

Root Lash: Basically Bone Grab but with a nature damage weapon smack. (suggest changing nature damage to acid damage to suit the theme)

Corrosive Mist: Change to sustain, reduce radius and add evasion. Shield block can block acid damage. Scale with armour.

Venomous Breath: Change to scale with constitution.

Marsh Wyrm - locked, requires level 10
Natural Vigor: Increases maximum life/stamina and life/stamina regeneration. (I wonder if it is useful for Wyrmics as they have Fungus, while stamina regeneration is covered by the Combat Veteran Tree)

Dissolve: (don't think the skill is needed anymore)

Venomous Quills: sustain. Adds nature damage to your attacks and when you are hit in melee. Scale with willpower.

Corrosive Breath: Change to scale with constitution. Change 25% disarm to 100% armour corrosion.

Wild Drake - granted instead of fungus by Myssil. requires level 10
Prismatic Slash: suggest lowering the cooldown to 12 with increased chance to crit

Nature's Defender: passive. Grants spell save, arcane resistance and damage shield penetration. Shield block can block arcane and nature damage. Scale with armour?

Chromatic Fury:

Antimagic Breath: Manaburn damage and dispel. Scales with constitution.

Blood Drake - Granted locked by consuming the Corrupted Heart. Require level 10. Ppassive blight resist on all talents. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and life!
Blood Spring: Melee attack that causes blood to flow around the victim, hrting enemies and healing you over time.

Bone Scales: sustain. Any damage hit above a % of your maximum life, reduces the damage to that amount and explodes bone shards around you, inflicting bleeding. Shield block also blocks blight damage. Scales with armour.

Wilt: AOE without direct damage which inflicts 2 random diseases and drains stamina from enemies. Affected enemies also take more damage from melee attacks

Sanguine Breath: Blight and disease infliction, scales with constitution.

Blink Drake - Granted locked by a drop from Rantha the Abomination. Require level 10. Passive temporal resist on all talents. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and paradox!
Blink Claw: active. Teleport next to target creature with a melee attack that inflicts temporal damage over time. (suggest also teleport-hitting random enemies in range before teleporting next to target creature, x% of the overkill damage are teleported to the target creature)

Phased Wyrm: sustain. Gives flat damage reduction against all types. Reduces debuff duration. Shield block can now block temporal. Scales with armour.

Time Sink: active. Drains time from target area, slowing affected creatures, doing temporal damage and hasting you. Scales with willpower.

Temporal Breath: Temporal and stat reduction, scales with constitution.

[HousePet]

While they do have Fungus, and Fungus is really good at healing and equilibrium regeneration, I wouldn't like to say that anyone has to go with Fungus to get healing and equilibrium regeneration.

[Parcae2]

I like the idea of giving Wyrmics some love. It would be nice to have the fourth talent in each wyrm tree add 2 size categories and change your character portrait to the appropriate wyrm type.

Edit: OK, I've thought about this some more. I think Wyrmics ought to be full-on draconic shapeshifters. I vaguely remember being told that shapeshifting is being reserved for a future Druid class, but I don't see any reason why you can't have both a jack-of-all-trades shapeshifter and a specialized class that is, in essence, permanently shapeshifted. I mean, if we aren't going this route, how on earth are talents like Wing Buffet and Swallow supposed to work?

Get rid of Fungus, it doesn't really have anything particularly draconic about it. Get rid of the weapon trees. Add a tree with talons, and one that replaces body armor with the ability to embed gems into your scaly hide. And we definitely need a Dragonflight tree.

[HousePet]

My reasoning for making some talents scale with armour and having Bellowing Roar synergise breath attacks went like this:
Wyrmics get a lot of different damage elements, this makes it hard for them to get a good benefit from increased damage equipment. So let's add another way of boosting those effects.
Which ended up as Drake Strength boost weapon talents via the strength boost, Drake Scales boosts the defensive talents via the armour bonus, Bellowing Roar and Breath weapons are all about lung capacity, let's synergise. I didn't get the forth talent worked out, but that would have improved the castery talents.

An added bonus of scaling with armour is that is gives you an extra bonus that you would loose if you went dual Psiblades.

I shall attempt to do some compaction of categories. That's right, squashed dragons!

[HousePet]

I've got it down to 9 categories!

Drake Form
Drake Strength: passive. Increases strength and knockback resistance and allows you to wield a shield with a two handed weapon.
Burrow: Bump attacks also knock enemies aside.
Cloud Seer: Increases sight range, lowers minimum equilibrium and gives blindness resistance.
Drake Transformation: active. Increases size/strength/armour. Adds extra weapon damage based on where you have spent talent points.

Drake Combat - each point spent in this category increases physical resistance and adds physical damage when transformed.
Swallow: Change to physical damage. Also grants extra small heal/equil restore on kills.
Flyby Slash: Leap Attack that dazes and then lands you nearby.
Wing Buffet:
Bellowing Roar:

Desert Drake - each point spent in this category increases fire resistance and adds fire damage when transformed.
Devouring Flame: Change to inflict burning and fire on the ground.
Ember Scales: Increases lite radius, burns adjacent enemies and leaves a trail of flames. Shield block can block fire damage. Scale with armour.
Quake: Add disarm to enemies.
Burning Sand Breath: Does half fire, half physical damage. Sets creatures on fire and blinds them.

Storm Drake - each point spent in this category increases lightning resistance and adds lightning damage when transformed.
Tornado: Make it move faster. Scale with willpower.
Static Field: Grants stun resistance and randomly fires mini chain lightnings. Shield block can block lightning damage.
Lightning Speed: Convert attack damage to lightning.
Storm Breath: Does half lightning, half physical damage. Inflicts knockback and daze.

Tundra Drake - each point spent in this category increases cold resistance and adds cold damage when transformed.
Ice Claw: Add iceblock pierce.
Icy Skin: Increases armour and inflicts cold+slow to attackers. Shield block can block cold damage.
Ice Wall: Freezes enemies caught in the wall.
Glacial Breath: Does half cold, half physical damage. Freezes and slows enemies.

Marsh Drake - each point spent in this category increases acid resistance and adds acid damage when transformed.
Root Lash: Basically Bone Grab but with a nature damage weapon smack.
Blinding Mist: Blinds adjacent creatures and provides evasion. Shield block can block acid damage.
Flood: Drowning/Nature damage AOE.
Corrosive Breath: Does half acid, half nature damage. Corrodes armour and poisons.

Wild Drake - granted locked instead of fungus by Myssil. requires level 10 - each point spent in this category increases nature resistance and adds nature damage when transformed.
Prismatic Slash:
Nature's Defender: passive. Grants spell save, arcane resistance and damage shield penetration. Shield block can block arcane damage.
Chromatic Fury:
Antimagic Breath: Manaburn damage and dispel.

Blood Drake - Granted locked by consuming the Corrupted Heart. Require level 10. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and life! - each point spent in this category increases blight resistance and adds blight damage when transformed.
Blood Spring: Melee attack that causes blood to flow around the victim, hurting enemies and healing you over time.
Bone Scales: sustain. Any damage hit above a % of your maximum life, reduces the damage to that amount and explodes bone shards around you, inflicting bleeding. Shield block also blocks blight damage.
Wilt: Weakens a group of enemies, reducing their damage and resistances.
Sanguine Breath: Blight and disease infliction.

Blink Drake - Granted locked by a drop from Rantha the Abomination. Require level 10. Warning, these are spells that cost equilibrium and paradox! - each point spent in this category increases temporal resistance and adds temporal damage when transformed.
Blink Claw: active. Teleport next to target creature with a melee attack that inflicts temporal damage over time.
Phased Wyrm: sustain. Gives flat damage reduction against all types. Reduces debuff duration. Shield block can now block temporal.
Time Sink: active. Drains time from target area, slowing affected creatures, doing temporal damage and hasting you.
Temporal Breath: Temporal and stat reduction.

[Suslik]

@HP srsly we don't need another archmage-like class with over 9000 trees and with only 2-3 bing viable. Why not trim down them to a reasonable amount getting leaving only the most interesting and synergetic trees and allowing 2-3 different and viable builds instead of 1 viable and 100 non-viable?

[HousePet]

But that is trimmed down. XD

[anonymous000]

Some random thoughts. Wyrmic's spells need some work too.

(Put an element here, I think Ice/Lightning need some help) Orb: Summon a stationary object with x life in range y which fires 1-2 lightning at random enemies in range z for 3 turns

Heat: Radiate oppressive heat from your body in range 3-4, inflicts x fire damage(no burning) and burns projectile within range, for turns equal to your talent level. Effectiveness (including the chance to burn projectiles/the reduction on the effectiveness of projectiles)decreases each turn.

Twister: Send a target spinning in a twister, taking physical & lightning(or ice) damage per turn. Affected enemy has x% chance to fail a complex action. Enemies who stand near to it have y% chance to be caught in it.

Draconic Combat tree, requires mindstars. Thematically you are calling forth the attacks (except for Thunder Wrath) instead of actually growing these things
Fire Claw: attack in a arc of range 2, short cooldown. Crit inflicts burning and has a chance to lower its cooldown by one turn.
Acidic Tail: 3 separate attacks in range 3, ignore obstacles, short cooldown. Crit inflicts poison and has a chance to lower its cooldown by one turn.
Ice Fang: beam attack in range 4, short cooldown. Crit inflicts bleeding and has a chance to lower its cooldown by one turn.
Thunder Wrath: Sustain, focus the energy of your Psiblades into a layer of plasma which wraps around your knuckle. Increase attack speed for your bump attack if Psiblade is on and inflict extra lightning damage. Crit inflicts small AOE which has a chance to daze. When it is on you cannot use other skills in the Psiblade tree

And some thoughts for the locked trees. The locked trees should provide a niche/special build choices. The individual talents look good to me, but when grouped into a tree they are simply good skills putting together without synergy or a coherent theme in terms of gameplay. Wild drake's theme is clear (buffing the 4 elements and some antimagic stuff), but Blood Drake and Blink Drake need some improvement.

For example, the Blink Drake tree can be about Conveyance:
When you target Blink Claw to yourself you teleport
When you cast Temporal Breath you caught the enemies in it, then release them in a cone. If you target the subsequent cone to yourself you teleport them

[astreoth]

okay I agree wyrmic needs work and their are some good ideas here but theirs a few things we should keep in mind.

as it is now the wyrmic class doesn't specialize in a single draconic aspect and in most cases it would be a horrible idea to try to as most aspects (i.e. every one but venom) have maybe two good abilities with the others being shitty, one shots, or stuff only good in synergy with other better ability's and the classes useful utility's are spread out around aspects.

this all adds up to a class that thrives on getting most of the draconic aspects and is largely intended to however some of the proposed changes here could change that such as the drake form tree while two handier + shield is pretty neat if you still have the two different weapon style trees then this will give the class a much wider class talent point spread that will make it more difficult to diversify in draconic aspects and possibly op since shield offense has stronger offensive ability's to compensate for lower bump attack.

so yeah these proposed changes would likely make specialization much more tempting and if one of the aspects ends up stronger than the others it will flat out kill viable build diversity so here is a few bullet points of
possible pitfalls with remaking wyrmic

-if we go with the two hander plus shield route we'll need to take away the two weapon styles and or include some kind of debuff in the talent so you can't use either as well as you could if you just focused on one individually done right this could give four different options of sword and board, hand and a half with buckler, two handier and mindstars.

-general dragon ability tree okay with this we got three choices either accept aspect specialization, make it an option, or discourage it with three different methods.
first is having this tree along with both of the weapon styles and the two hander plus shield keep the really useful utility's like swallow and a rush ability in the dragon tree to make it as you should cap this as the first three ability's of the alchemists bombs tree. this should draw enough points into these three trees that the aspect trees can be interchanged to taste and mostly specialized in. if really want to hit specialization home give each tree one or two 30 - 20 equilibrium sustains making a bulk of each aspects power effectively passive and and letting equilibrium apply a limit to how effectively you can diversify.
second is to either not give two hander plus shield and or replace the weapon specific trees with a draconic combat tree or a tree for two hander plus shield talents. this will give more room for draconic aspects while still making it easy to specialize if you want.
third option is to strip out the weapon trees and have the general dragon ability tree talents give active and passive ability's. so it can be a general I'm a dragon tree and a draconic combat tree giving you as much room for diversification as getting the weapon specializations does now. if really want to encourage diversification can do the bellowing roar in the dragon tree amps up the power of breaths, so you don't need quite as many points to get a lot of them up with decent damage.

-consolidating dragons is a bad idea thematically.
yeah wyrmic works by becoming more like specific types of dragons not environments of dragons I know that's not really working out to well right now, but thats more because 1 a lot of the aspects have shit ability's in them and 2 as a combo warrior class our fighting ability shouldn't be as good as the dedicated warriors like berserker and bulwark. but we should be able to compensate with draconic ability's like other combo classes do with their other ability's(arcane combat, burning hands, rampage, telekineticlly wielded weapons, retribution, weapon folding)but we only have icy scales in that regard. so a lot of the classes problems could easily be solved by turning a few shitty talents into passives or sustains to draconically augment offensive capability's.
so yeah try to work with the dragons already in game.

-keep breaths good
okay as the discussion is going currently there is the possibility of breaths becoming less spammy from less of them to spam or more spammy from greater diversification now breaths are a major trademark of the wyrmic so they need to be potent either way so I'm going to propose a way to do this in relation to the above.
alright idea for this proposal comes from housepets bellowing roar proposal and some other guy I don't remember saying we should make breaths into sustains.
okay the idea here is to make breaths into sustains like auras that will power up over time giving you more damage when you release the sustain and have bellowing roar increase the damage the breaths gain over time while investment in the breaths them selves increases how many turns they can charge up and increases their cooldown dependent on how much you charged the breath before releasing.
this will allow those who want to spam breaths to lightly invest in a bunch of breath talents for shorter cooldowns while specialists can have insanely powerful breaths but with very large effective cooldowns. can prevent spammy and powerful from over lapping with resource limitations such as high equilibrium sustain costs or constant stamina drain from charging, having them set each other on cooldown too at a certain investment level, having the breaths share a max charge level that limits you to either a bunch of weak breaths, a single powerfull one and anything in between.

-keep equilibrium recovery in mind.
okay presently theirs a few proposed changes to swallow about making it effective as more than just a finisher want to make this very clear don't break wyrmics equilibrium recovery one point here late game gives incredible equilibrium recovery as someone who got a wyrmic to high peak I'll tell you now this ability is necessary to keep your breath spamming equilibrium manageable without using mindstars for quick heal/equilibrium fix if you break this it will break the classes innate ability to handle large equilibrium surges forcing builds susceptible to such into using mindstars to compensate seriously damaging build diversity.

-make dragon powers useful for more that just breaths.
okay one of the major weaknesses of wyrmic is your draconic powers can't increase your bump attack damage unlike literally every other warrior combo class. the only real synergy between their draconic and warrior talents is icy scales and that doesn't help damage leaving wyrmics with the half assed warrior skills and half assed draconic skills that just don't make the full ass that other melee/something classes do with their abilities. making draconic and warrior synergies will do a lot for this class.

-make sure to keep the passive aspects of the class
yeah considering you get element proofing from becoming more dragony with talent point investment this class really should have more passives and sustains than it does currently keep that in mind.

yeah that's all I got for stuff to keep in mind about remaking the class and suggestions on how to do it.

[Atarlost]

As things currently stand breaths are an all or nothing investment because range scales with talent level. My 1.0.5 wyrmic win used three of them maxed out as a mindstar user. If range is made nonscaling either the lesser dragons get seriously buffed or the wyrmic loses his only long range options. I think this is just something we need to work around.

Sand Drake (phys except swallow)

• Swallow (phys power): Workable, but a one point talent. Damage type is a liability.
• Quake (strength): Sometimes useful for creating cover.
• Burrow: great talent.
• Sand Breath (strength): good damage type but second worst damage. Blind rarely works.

Fire Drake (half phys half fire)

• Bellowing Roar (strength): All around good talent.
• Wing Buffet (strength): knockback with little damage on a mostly melee class? pass.
• Devouring Flame (will): DoT that can also hurt you.
• Fire Breath (strength): highest damage breath but over time.

Cold Drake (cold)

• Ice Claw (physical power): Well, it's an attack button and it can freeze.
• Icy Skin (will): Increases armor and retaliation damage, but also forces you into heavy armor since armor training is the only hardiness booster.
• Ice Wall: worth a point (or three if I remember the scaling right) for blocking line of effect and movement.
• Ice Breath (strength): best up front breath damage. Not much freeze chance.

Storm Drake (lightning and physical)

• Lightning Speed: excellent power.
• Static Field (mindpower): useless. It can't kill so it doesn't clear mooks and the effect is reduced against higher rank monsters.
• Tornado (mindpower): I don't know. It's more than numbers so I'd need to try it and the talents before and after suck.
• Lightning Breath (strength): the weakest breath and unreliable.

Venom Drake (acid)

• Acidic Spray (mindpower): Excellent and eventually spammable.
• Corrosive Mist (mindpower): DoT and debuff. Excellent.
• Dissolve (physical power): Lots of hits for lots of onhit effects.
• Corrosive Breath (strength): middling damage, but it's on a good tree.

Higher Draconic (mixed)

• Prizmatic Slash (physical power): Too long cooldown and not reliable against foes with high resistance to an element.
• Venomous Breath (strength): Slow DoT in a bad type.
• Wyrmic Guile: Cunning is little used so this is mainly for effect resists.
• Chromatic Fury: Damage and Penetration boosts, but not really enough to compensate for inability to damage stack.

In general, what about putting some resistance penetration with all the breaths? 2% per raw TL would make the wyrmic cap at 30% resist penetration with most wild dragons maxing out at 10% since they don't have the higher draconic tree. The breaths also have the general problem that the side effects are mindpower scaled while the damage is strength scaled. I think they're overvalued in determining how much damage the talents should do. I'd make all breaths except fire do closer to the same damage. (Fire can continue to do more since it's DoT)

On the Earth tree the biggest change I think is needed is to make swallow physical typed. Gnawing on someone is a lot more like hitting them than it is like poisoning them. It also might be a good idea to make burrow a sustain.

In the Fire tree I think I would get rid of wing buffet. Wyrmics don't have wings to buffet with. Instead how about a rush talent doing fire damage? Also, devouring flame is described too similarly to a breath and can friendly fire. Unfortunately I don't have a good replacement.

The Ice has a boring first talent until it can ice block. Making the freeze chance scale with talent level rather than suddenly appearing at TL 4 would help, but I think freeze is probably the wrong effect. Possibly a slow? Icy Skin should scale off of strength since it's a melee power and include some armor hardiness for leather wearers. This would make Ice a good specialization tree for melee wyrmics.

For Storm I'd consider making the Lightning Speed cooldown drop with investment. It's good, but it's kind of a one point wonder and certainly not more than three. Static Field is terrible as is. What about replacing it with a sustain that fires lightning at nearby foes and doesn't break Lightning Speed?

Venom is good as is. It might bear some nerfing as the other trees are brought up to pick up the slack, but nothing needs to change its nature.

Higher is a mess. First problem is the first talent. It fights against specialization, has too long a cooldown for an anti-crowd talent, and can fizzle completely against resistant enemies. The cooldown should drop to around 6 and it should choose its damage type with a weighted randomization in proportion to your talent investment in the main draconic aspect trees. Venomous Breath is just bad. Lots of stuff is poison immune. I'd replace it with a general breath booster: probably a cooldown reducer, either passive or instant active. Wyrmic Guile dates from when Wyrmics had berserker and berserker also gave stun resist. With that synnergy gone it should be improved. Chromatic Fury doesn't need to change if my suggestion above about putting some resistance penetration on the breath talents is taken.

[Planetus]

I think one problem is that wyrmics are multi-elemental themed (and most people do that), but the talent trees are all single-element, so any build needs to invest a good bit in all the trees, which is painful to balance. I strongly suggest the idea of doing away with strict elementally themed trees. I'd say the focus of builds should come down to 1 or 2 of the following 3 trees:

Wyrmic Body: Str based, various physical attacks/physical power boosts, maybe armor and/or dodge, at some point (I lean toward the final talent at 5, not the first at 1) allow 2-handed weapons to be wielded with 1 hand, so you can do 2H and shield.

Wyrmic Mind: Wil based, not sure if this should be mindstar melee based or mindstar caster-type. If melee based, probably grant defense and resists scaling with wil/cun/mindpower. I like the idea of every attack dealing an AoE, maybe make it a random element from the dragon elements?

Wyrmic Breath: Here are all the breath attacks. If you want more than 4, maybe make one talent give all the breath attacks (like traps or poisons give more than one) and the rest give scaling benefits (add status effects, increase range, maybe something to change the breath from cone to ball). This shouldn't be exclusively based on Str or Wil. I'm thinking either base it on Con (thematically works, but something should give a boost to the effects of Con in there), or make each breath scale with a different stat (maybe even have an anti-magic breath that scales with magic? maybe not).

Wyrmic Attack: varous melee attacks
Wyrmic Rage: various ranged attacks
Wyrmic Speed: various utility skills

2-handers
Sw&Shield

This easily breaks up the build process, so someone going one way can invest in fewer trees.