Our community module

[Grey]

I'm not trolling, I'm giving honest advice - get a public release out which has some real gameplay in it. There's 11 pages of discussion about precise details of this and that and nothing about when to get a real release. When you have a playable game (with basic combat and enemies and a simple win condition) you'll be able to have better informed discussion and more useful suggestions from players.

Keep in mind that a lot of the plans and details implemented so far will drastically change when you have a real game to play and have a better long term plan. Your main focus should be on getting a release, not fiddling with easily changeable details.

If it seems like I'm trolling it's because I'm honestly frustrated by the lack of focus here. I want a new module to play! And I want it now! :P There's no excuse not to have a basic game at this point. I mentioned this to yufra on IRC and he said he'd try and get something sorted by the end of today, so that's promising :)

Incidentally, tiger_eye's new hex modifications to the T-engine look ideally suited to this game - something to look into in the future.

[Canderel]

Adjectives like 'shocking' when referring to the progress of the project evokes emotional responses from me. My humblest apologies if you didn't mean anything, but I doubt that that specific part of the comment encouraged development.

It is admittedly much easier to contribute an idea if the project has more meat. My personal feeling is that the start of the project has brought about so many good things already, and I am proud of a month's work:
* Changes to the core engine
* People becoming more comfortable with the base that the b37 bugfix addons were created (which happens to be where most of the coders' available time went to.
* Establishing the git clone of the repo, which is now where the community branches, such as the hex patch is kept.

[Grey]

Perhaps I should add more smileys and winky faces - I meant "Shocking" in the most jovial of ways possible. Alas, jokey tones are often lost in online discourse :(

Still, it takes an hour to make a basic playable game. Changes to the engine etc are pretty irrelevant at this stage. The focus is all on structures and set-ups rather than on real gameplay. If you have something properly playable then that all takes shape much more easily. Obviously everyone's busy with their own things, but if they have something more cohesive to work on I'm sure they'd contribute a lot more.

And you really should be more open to criticism, however rudely it's presented. Advice is often best from those outside the project. Saying "you're not involved, you shouldn't troll" isn't helpful to anyone.

Keep in mind I've seen many many failed projects on RGRD over the years. I've no doubt this module will get released at some point, as there are many dedicated and intelligent people working on it, but the current focus and direction makes it look like that'll be many months away. Which seems silly to me when the T-Engine is so easy to work with.

[yufra]

Thanks for the interest Grey. I have got a very basic version uploaded to my personal GitHub clone. Currently there is a single NPC (lukep's Acidic Amoeba) in a Trollmire-inspired forest. If you manage to kill an amoeba you will be rewarded by their body (real corpses, hurray!) and an Acidic Gland gene. If you picked the Mr. Roboto birth option you will happen to have an empty GENE slot on your head, and once you pop that Acidic Gland gene in there you will now have access to T_ACID_SPRAY. Writing it down it doesn't sound like much, but the framework is set for more content to be added and feedback to be garnered.

Oh, and remember that this module requires some changes to the engine that are coming in b38, and for now the corresponding teae can be on the GitHub page. And it is late so hopefully this makes sense.

[Rectifier]

Holy shit thats cool Yufra, I need to contribute more...later.

[lukep]

I made a fork for myself (here), but still haven't figured out how to work with it.

EDIT: added it.

In the interests of getting this out a day or two earlier than if I spent the time learning git stuff, here's another NPC:

Code: Select all

NAME = "Utility Drone"
BASE_HP = 60
ALIGNMENT = -1
TYPE = "Robot"
SUBTYPE = "Drone"
BASE = "drone-cyberpart"

The talents still need to be coded, I haven't looked at that part of the code enough yet.

Code: Select all

local Talents = require "mod.class.interface.PartTalents"

newEntity{base = "BASE_CYBERPART",
	define_as = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	subtype = "drone",
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Chassis",
	slot = "TORSO",
	size = 15,
	body = { COVER = 1, HEAD = 1, ARM = 4, LEG = 1, EYE = 1},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[The core part of a drone.]],
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Cavorite Pod",
	slot = "LEG",
	size = 2,
	body = {},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Antigravity plates, adjustable for mobility.  ]],
	talents = {
		[Talents.T_CHARGE] = 1,
-- Charge rushes up to 4 tiles, then prompts for a melee attack to attack with (instantly).
	}
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Spectral Scanner",
	slot = "EYE",
	size = 0,
	body = {},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Short range detection of fine detail.]],
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Manipulator",
	slot = "ARM",
	size = 2,
	body = {GRIP = 1},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Manipulate the environment.  ]],
	talents = {
		[Talents.T_PUNCH] = 1,
	}
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Arc Welder",
	slot = "ARM",
	size = 2,
	body = {},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Electrify and fuse metal.  ]],
	talents = {
		[Talents.T_ZAP] = 1,
-- Zap does a good amount of energy damage, at high cost.
	}
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Staple Gun",
	slot = "ARM",
	size = 2,
	body = {},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Stick things together.  ]],
	talents = {
		[Talents.T_SHOOT] = 1,
-- a short ranged, weak attack.  Low/no cost.
	}
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Extrusion nozzle",
	slot = "ARM",
	size = 2,
	body = {},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Extrudes various chemicals, from solvents to insulation to glue.  ]],
	talents = {
		[Talents.T_ENTANGLE] = 1,
-- weak melee debuff, deals chemical damage over time.  
	}
}

newEntity{base = "DRONE_CYBERPART",
	name = "Distributed Logic Tree",
	slot = "HEAD",
	size = 0,
	body = {GENE = 1},
	level_range = {1, 10},
	rarity = 1,
	desc = [[Think about the environment.  ]],
}

[Canderel]

Lukep: join the IRC channel, yufra, tiger-eye and even perhaps me could help you with the git stuff.

[bricks]

OK, time to jump back on this wagon. I've (partly) figured out how to use git's command line interface, so I was able to actually roll back my fork and bring in the commits from the latest version. I'm sure I made it more complicated than needed and I'm a little concerned that there are some merge artifacts hanging out, but it's working.

It's oddly compelling already; picking up the acid glands and shoving them in my mouth was a funny image. I'm going to start tearing out all of the pointless sync/fidelity mess I put in there and then look at the coordinated cooldown system I brought up earlier. There are also a few UI oddities that I'm going to poke at.

Edit: I'm noticing that the gene is handled kind of messily. I'm not sure yet what the best move would be, since genes/modules are kind of like equippable egos...

[yufra]

Edit: I'm noticing that the gene is handled kind of messily. I'm not sure yet what the best move would be, since genes/modules are kind of like equippable egos...

What did you have in mind for genes/modules? I had thought they were always intended to be like equip-able egos, allowing you to customize etc. Some egos give passive bonuses (+damage, bla bla) while others give active abilities (grant a talent) so there is flexibility there. Or did you mean that you don't like how the gene/modules are coded?

[bricks]

Yeah sorry, that was rambly. I was talking about the applying/unapplying of the talent to the part. I was pondering whether there was a more concerted means of handling this, but depending on how complicated genes becomes, that may not be the case.

Edit: I think I broke my repo...
Edit2: Well, maybe not. Looks like Github is having some issues. Anyway, I removed any sync/fidelity references, reimplemented cooldowns, and fixed a few bugs regarding cooldowns (hotkeys not displaying cooldowns properly, talents not on the base body part refusing to cool down). If Github turns out to be the hold-up, I'll merge those into my master branch and initiate a pull request.

[yufra]

Alright everybody, the DG whip has been cracked and we got a plug on the latest RLR episode so we really need to get moving. My top priority is going to be getting either (a) the remaining engine changes into b39 or (b) getting GR working without those changes. I have pulled in bricks' last changes (my bad for the delay). There are the neat features that I want to work on like modifying GameTargeting so that you can preview the effects (and their probabilities) during targeting, and having NPCs randomly created and evolved, but those are all things to add later I think. Reenen, can you give us some focus for the next week or so with a list/schedule? Cheers!

EDIT: Oh, and bricks can you hang out on IRC more? It might help for us to chat.

[Canderel]

Focus: players must be able to progress. Currently they can gain new mutations and items, but for now we can add small stuff like, gain x hp regen, gain x max health, etc to make players feel like they are progressing. Next is a win condition. Or at least a boss of a kind. For now it can spawn on the downstairs. And give/drop a semi standard char progressing mutation or item.

[bricks]

Yeah yufra, definitely. My schedule has been extremely weird lately but I should be able to participate more.

Putting a boss together sounds like a good move, I'll start brainstorming.

[marvalis]

Interesting too read. If the game currently has no HP scaling yet, then consider simply not adding this. Instead, keep hp the same (adjusted by modifiers like equipment, genes and whatsnot). Use exp not to scale HP, but just so the player can increase its skills. Looks like this module is going to have most of the things I wanted to see in a game. Pretty awesome.

As a reference, look at for example cataclysm roguelike. I have been playing this game the last week or so after hearing about it on roguelike radio. There is no HP scaling in this game, and I am not missing it at all (there are also no levels but instead skill-grind). The game can be found at whalesdev.com

Just a few idea's:

* long term resource

As a long term resource, how about adding genetic stability? Some monsters, like 'horrible mutations' and 'toxic cysts' will deal normal damage and also decrease your genetic stability a little bit. As your genetic stability decreases, you begin having a higher chance of gaining 'cancerous growth' 's.

Each cancerous growth can have a number of negative effects, perhaps depending on the type of cancer and its location. An aggressive cancer in your eyes could reduce your vision range and it would get worse if you don't cure it. Some cancers might be stable, and other might cure themselves. You will have to do something to cure your cancers. I'm not sure how this should be done, but there might be a number of ways to do this: Consumables, resting/sleeping, doing surgery on yourself (with the right tools). Perhaps you will find a hospital with a surgical robot that can help you.

A long term resource like this can be used to make sure the player does not spend to much time in one particular area. Some area's might be very toxic, and constantly decrease your genetic stability. Other area's might also give increase chances of cancerous growth. Piles of radioactive waist could be very dangerous if you get to close.

Messing around with genetics, might also lower your genetic stability. This ensure a 'soft cap' on messing with your genes. I am not sure how this would work out for bionics.

For example, there might be an item called 'genetic stabilizer'. Consuming this will temporarily increase your genetic stability. However, as the effect wears off you will loose the stability. Players with a lot of genetic mutations might be less stable, and have a need for more stabilizers to get trough that particular level. Avoiding cancerous growths could be important. So suppose you enter a heavily radiated chamber. You notice your genetic stability has dropped dangerously low: from 85% to 65%. You use a bottle of genetic stabilizer, and your genetic stability is temporarily improved to 95%. As you spend more time in the chamber, your stability keeps dropping (both the modified and unmodified stability). When the effect wears off, your genetic stability is only 40%, dangerously low.

If your genetic stability becomes 0, you mutate into a horribly deformed blob with some bionics sticking out (effectively player death).


Game levels could have background radiation. As you spend more time on a level, this radiation might increase, forcing you to eventually leave or suffer genetic damage.


Each time you operate yourself to remove a cancer, there might be a chance to permanently lower one of your stats. The game would get progressively harder as the player deteriorates. You will get weaker, slower, less able to dodge, and you have to fight your way trough the hordes in order to escape.

Several ending might be possible: finding a spaceship and escaping the planet, finding the source of radiation and blowing it up, defeating the evil corrupter and restoring stability, find a permanent stabilizer, finding an underground garden of eden, etc). For example, in one game you might find some clues about an underground civilization, you do a series of quests and events that eventually lead you underground. After a while you get to know certain people, you find a certain item, and you unlock a secret passage into the mountains. There you find an underground garden of eden. You never grow old, you are cured of all diseases and radiation, and you live there in secret forever more. In another ending you might find some spaceship parts, find someone to assemble them with, you meet at the spaceship, and in the end you fly into outer space in search for better life elsewhere (you probably end up dead consumed by some distant star or blown up in a supernova).

[yufra]

Thanks for encouragement marvalis. The mechanics are definitely in flux still, and we originally had a long-term resource similar to what you suggested but it got sidelined for one reason or another. I think we do need to pick up some long-term resources again, so definitely keep the ideas coming. I also envision an experience-less game, where progression is solely based on character customization (genes, bionic parts, etc) and story. We'll see how it goes!