Archer/Mage class (alpha 1)

[lukep]

EDIT: see most recent post for zip file.

We already have a warrior/mage and rogue/mage (Arcane Blade and Shadowblade), and hybrid classes are some of the ones that I enjoy most, so, here's my idea for a archer/mage, tentatively called the Ranger (I know, it's not a very representative name, come up with a better one.)

It is an archer with both supporting spells and two new skill trees complementing its archery abilities. It would start with the skills Phase Door, Bow Mastery, Flare, and Magic Bow. It's talent category breakdown:

-Magical Archery (1.3, class)
-Elemental Arrows (1.3, class)
-Archery - Bows (1.1, class)
-Archery Training (1.1, class, locked)
-Archery Prowess (1.1, class)
-Combat Veteran (1.2, class, locked)
-Combat Training (1.2 generic)
-Survival (1.0, generic, locked)
-Conveyance (1.0, generic)
-Phantasm (1.0, class)
-Divination (1.0, generic)

In total, it has 7 (2 locked) class trees, and 4 (1 locked) generic trees, a bit low, but not too bad. Now for the two new trees:

Techniques/Magical Archery Similar to Shadow Combat/Magical Combat. Class skill requiring Dexterity.
Magic Bow: passive
Your magic stat replaces Strength for the purposes of bow damage, at a rate of (50 + 10 * talent)% effectiveness.
Dexterous Magic: passive
+ spellpower based on your dexterity, at a rate of (15 + 5 * talent)%
Mana Gain: Sustained, 40 stamina
(0.07 * talent) mana regen.
Magic Reinforcement: Sustained, 50 stamina
Increases physical crit by 50% of your spell crit, and physical power by (4 * talent)% of your spellpower.

Techniques/Elemental Arrows Changes the damage type to an element, and adds a secondary effect at level 3. Costs 3 mana per arrow shot. All are sustained, and similar to Alchemists Infusions in that only one can be active (except you can also turn it off)
Fire Arrow: Sustained, 20 Stamina, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Changes your arrows to (50-100)% as much fire damage. At level three it adds a weak burn effect for 3 turns, about the power of burning wake.
Lightning Arrow: Sustained, 20 Stamina, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Changes your arrows to (50-100)% as much lightning damage. At level three it increases the shot velocity by (100 * talent)%, and range by (talent / 2, rounded down, maximum of 10 range)
Acid Arrow: Sustained, 20 Stamina, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Changes your arrows to (50-100)% as much acid damage. At level three it adds acid splash, reducing armor and accuracy by (2 * talent) and dealing weak acid damage over 3 turns.
Cold Arrow: Sustained, 20 Stamina, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Changes your arrows to (50-100)% as much cold damage. At level three it becomes ice damage, gaining 25% chance to freeze.

Things that I an still concerned with:
-The names of the class, and all of the Magical Archery skills should be replaced with better ones.
-Cold Arrow needs to be changed, both to not be overpowered, and to fit the others better.
-Dexterous Magic and Mana Gain are exactly the same as Arcane Dexterity and Arcane/Shadow Feed. Might not be a problem.
-Conveyance (especially Probability Travel) + archer skills may be too powerful.
-Volley of Arrows may lead to unexpectedly high mana costs. (up to ~250 at high levels)
-Flare could act unexpectedly with elemental arrows (probably just deal with it)
-Fire/Acid DoT effects could easily be overpowered, or useless.

Share your ideas about the class, especially if you can resolve one of my concerns.

[TheRani]

I think someone else was already working on a Ranger class, but it was more of a nature-based archer with rogue traps. Maybe Arcane Archer would be a better name for this class than Ranger.

The elemental arrow techniques seem rather unappealing. How about instead you could make them the elemental versions of Weapon Folding, and have them be mutually exclusive sustains that cost a chunk of your mana (Not stamina), that add an amount of elemental damage based on talent level and spellpower to all arrow attacks, with chance and duration of associated side-effects (dazing, freezing, burning, acid splash) determined by talent level?

[jenx]

Arrows add elemental already. I would this prefer arcane or light or darkness or blight damage. That way you could get element + arcane etc, and you would have ooptions against various resists

[lukep]

Arcane Archer as a name sounds too similar to me to Arcane Blade, but it's a step in the right direction.

(50-100)% damage is a bit weak...I hadn't put enough thought into balancing the numbers well, changing it to (100-150)% would help, and I like the level 3 boosts. On the other hand, I like exotic damages for it more, and a weapon folding style effect makes more sense, so what about:

Spells/Imbued Arrows: Costs 3 mana per arrow shot. All are mutually exclusive sustains. All are the same power, approximately the same as Weapon Folding. Most effects are for 3 turns, except poison (5 turns) and Disease (same as normal)
Thermal Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 20 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Fire and Cold damage (1/2 each). Also has a (10 * talent)% chance to apply one of Burning or Frozen on hit.
Grounding Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 20 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Acid and Lightning damage (1/2 each). Also has a (10 * talent)% chance to apply one of Acid Splash or Dazed on hit.
Holy Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 20 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Light, Nature, and Mind damage (1/3 each). Also has a (10 * talent)% chance to apply one of Blind, Poisoned, or Confused on hit.
Corrupted Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 20 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Dark, Blight, and Arcane damage (1/3 each). Also has a (10 * talent)% chance to apply one of Pinned, Disease, or Stun on hit.

[lukep]

Well, coded it and tried it, rebalanced some, and changed some skills that I couldn't code as I wanted them to be. Going to keep on refining it until I think it doesn't have any more overpowered combinations/skills, and is still fun and powerful enough to play.

[catwhowalksbyhimself]

Rather than just having just those slightly different elemental arrows as separate skills, combine them under that same skill (similar to who trapping works) then have some skills that work like mage attack spells, but fire an arrow first, then trigger the spell effect only if the arrow hits.

So, for example, a lighning field that works a as a spell, you activate it and pay the manna cost, but first a normal arrow first, then only if it hits, the lightning field is but down. You could do a couple of different things like that which would make it a bit more interesting and different.

I like the concept though and will gladly include it in my mod if you want to include it.

[lukep]

I think that having all of the different types of infused arrows available for 5 class points would give the class way too much versatility for the cost. The way it is now is similar to the Alchemist' Infusion tree, one of the only trees that deals a different damage type every skill. Almost all other categories are exclusively one (or two) damage type(s) over the entire tree.

I really like your idea for arrow triggered spells though, hence this incomplete idea for a talent tree:

Charged Arrows: Level 10+ tree, first talent is activated skills, others are boosts.
Charged Shot: 20 mana, 15 cooldown.
Gives you access to the five shots listed after the tree. All deal an AoE damage and effect. Each one raises the cooldown of all the others by 7 (see Recharging) when used to prevent spamming of the charged shots.
Overcharged: passive
Charges Shots explode in a radius of (1, 2, 2, 3, 3), dealing (5, 10, 15, 20, 25)% increased damage
Recharging: passive
Reduces the cooldown increase to (6, 5, 4, 3, 2) turns
Desaturate: 50 mana, (40 - 5 * talent) coooldown
Takes all of the charged arrows off of cooldown.

Fragmenting Arrow: Explodes for fire damage and deep cut (bleed + healing reduction) effect.
Obscuring Arrow: Explodes for darkness damage and sticky smoke effect (reduced vision range).
Endothermic Arrow: Explodes for cold damage and (???)% chance to freeze.
Warping Arrow: Explodes for temporal damage and chance to teleport.
Cursed Arrow: Explodes for Blight Damage and chance to apply random curse or hex.

I don't know if I could have it not explode if it misses (also, I'm not sure if it would be better), it will probably end up similar to Flare in execution.

Also, I would be glad to have it in your mod (or anywhere else) when it's a polished and balanced class.

[bricks]

How about "Spellbow?" Also, instead of a traditional phase-door ability, why not an arrow-based ability that teleports you to where the arrow hits? Alternatively, it could be used to switch places with target monster. A temporary accuracy debuff (it's severity or duration decreased with skill level) would help balance it.

Another thing to consider is sling-based skills; perhaps with an alchemy bent.

[lukep]

Update on the class, as it has changed noticeably. Temporary name is Magebow, and it currently has +5 dexterity, +4 magic, +2 life rating, and 100 health. It has these talent trees:

-Archery - Bows (1.1, class)
-Archery Training (1.1, class, locked)
-Archery Prowess (1.1, class)
-Combat Techniques (1.2, class, locked)
-Combat Veteran (1.2, class, locked)
-Combat Training (1.2 generic)
-Survival (1.0, generic, locked)
-Phantasm (1.0, class, locked)
-Arrows (1.3, class)
-Bowcasting (1.3, class)
-Conveyance (1.0, generic)
-Divination (1.0, generic)

and starts with:
Arcane Eye
Flare
Thermal Arrows
Magical Draw
Shoot

The new talent trees do:

Spells/Arrows: All are mutually exclusive sustains.
Thermal Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 10 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Fire and Cold damage (total as much as weapon folding). Also has a (10 + 3 * talent)% chance to apply one of Burning (3 turns, 10 damage per turn) or Frozen (3 turns, 300hp) on hit.
Grounding Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 10 cooldown, -3 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Acid and Lightning damage (total as much as weapon folding). Also has a (10 + 3 * talent)% chance to apply one of Acid Splash (3 turns, 10 damage per turn, -20 accuracy) or Dazed (3 turns) on hit.
Holy Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 10 cooldown, -5 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Light, Nature, and Mind damage (total 1.5x as much as weapon folding). Also has a (10 + 3 * talent)% chance to apply one of Blind (3 turns) , Poisoned (5 turns, 10 damage per turn), or Confused (3 turns, 60% power) on hit.
Corrupted Arrow: Sustained, 40 mana, 10 cooldown, -5 mana per arrow shot.
Deals Dark, Blight, and Arcane damage (total 1.5x as much as weapon folding). Also has a (10 + 3 * talent)% chance to apply one of Pinned (3 turns), Weakness Disease (5 turns, 10 damage per turn, -20 str), or Silence (3 turns) on hit.

Spells/Bowcasting:
Magical Draw: passive
Replaces Strength with Magic for the purposes of bow damage. Adds (2, 4, 6, 8, 10) physical crit rate.
Dexterous Casting: passive
+(20, 40, 60, 80, 100)% spell casting speed (note +100% means it takes half of a turn)
Magical Feed: sustained, 5 cooldown, 10 mana
regenerate (talent /14) mana per turn, the same as arcane feed or shadow feed.
Forceful Shooting: sustained, 20 mana, 15 cooldown, -10 mana per turn
+(15 + 4 * talent)% physical damage.

Thoughts?

[Goblinz]

the class looks fine. It might be nice to have a tree that has activated abilities but that is your choice (chain lightning arrow). for the elemental arrow effect you may want those to scale with talent level and the percent chance could have a little influence based of some stat (dex?).

[Grey]

I'm not sure what this really adds to the class beyond added ego affects on arrows... I like the idea of some mage/archer fusion, but I think it has to be more inventive. And no, I don't have any particularly bright ideas myself :/ But it should try and link in with some existing mage trees, and give them some real spells that give them a unique flavour. They should use magic for interesting movement and debuffing abilities, and maybe more ways to hit multiple enemies at once.

Replacing Strength with Magic for bow damage seems a little weird I think. And what about slingers...? I actually think slingers would make a more interesting mage hybrid. Could keep the cunning relevance of the class and make them very spell crit focussed.

But perhaps a good mage/archer hybrid should actually use the divine trees instead?

[lukep]

It might be nice to have a tree that has activated abilities but that is your choice (chain lightning arrow)

Do you mean like the "Charged Arrows" tree (two above my last post) or something different? I didn't include it because it wasn't coded and added yet.

for the elemental arrow effect you may want those to scale with talent level and the percent chance could have a little influence based of some stat (dex?).

I tried to make the effect scale with talent level, but couldn't code it...might need help there. As for the chance to apply effect being linked to a stat as well, good idea, added.

Replacing Strength with Magic for bow damage seems a little weird I think. And what about slingers...? I actually think slingers would make a more interesting mage hybrid. Could keep the cunning relevance of the class and make them very spell crit focussed.

I replaced Strength with Magic to give the class fewer stats to focus on, but that might have made the class too focused, with not enough tradeoffs. As for slings, I have been leaning increasingly in that direction the more I work on this class, and might change it over some time. If I changed it, then it would most likely be a Spellslinger.

But perhaps a good mage/archer hybrid should actually use the divine trees instead?

Good idea, that is another project to think about. An archer with the tanking/healing aspects of the Divine trees would be interesting to play.

[Goblinz]

Do you mean like the "Charged Arrows" tree (two above my last post) or something different? I didn't include it because it wasn't coded and added yet.

For this I meant either 1 of 2 things - have the arrow proc an elemental a aoeeffect when when it hits (that effect could be a chain lightning) or the arrow mimics the effect (the arrow jumps around like chain lightning).

To get the talent level just use self:getTalentLevel(self.T_FOO)

you could also proc spells when arrows hit (like arcane combat).

[Grey]

I'd love the idea of archery proccing spells like arcane combat. This could work great with the divine spells Searing Light and Moonlight Ray. Glyphs triggered by archery would be cool too.

[Hedrachi]

I like the idea and class, but atm the way you've described the class talents, they seem to make the class more of a "Archer/Psionicist/Mage" rather than a Archer/Mage. Thermal just doesn't sound... magey to me. Maybe split the actual sustain for this into two separate talents, but keep the talent in the talent screen, like the way poisons and traps work? Same for Grounding arrow. As for the -5 mana/shot talents, with resistances factored in are they still going to do 1.5x the damage weapon folding gives? If each damage type is half the temporal damage weapon folding gives, will that be enough in the prides to be of use?