ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

What exactly is the requirement for getting GC's offer? I heard it was 10 talent levels worth of spells, but I'm still a bit unclear of what that means. And even more importantly, if you miss out on his offer the first time around (you bring him down but don't meet the requirements), can you still come back later and retry? Or is it the kind of thing that's set in stone once you enter the zone? Do locked trees count towards the requirement?

What about spell abilities you can get through items? I have a volcanic wand that grants volcano talent at level 5, which is a spell according to the tool tip. Would that count as 5 levels worth of spells for GC? Do runes count? They are also considered spells, tool-tip wise.

I'm kind of bummed about missing out on Hexes. I went in with 4 runes, stone touch, healing light, chant of fortress, arcane eye and premonition (each at .8, from escorts), but I guess I should've been more careful and learned staff mastery beforehand.

At least I got a fiery choker out of it

I believe the requirement is to know (i.e. have invested points in) 10 abilities labeled as spells. I would assume the check is made when you get his health low enough to trigger the special dialogue.

Okay, lets rephrase the question.

What is the minimum amount of work you need to do on a class that starts with no spells whatsoever to be able to qualify for the Hexes tree from GC?

Hard Mode: with as little dependency on escort spawns as possible
European Extreme Mode: without using more than 3 generic talent points

You need at least 11 levels of spells.
9 is not enough.

HousePet wrote:You need at least 11 levels of spells.
9 is not enough.

I came back with staff mastery learned and 3 points in channel staff. If my math is correct, wouldn't that give me 4 levels from runes, 4 levels from escort spells (chant, healing light, stone touch, arcane eye, premonition, each at .8) and 3 from channel staff, adding up to 11? I also had a volcanic wand equipped which grants volcano spell at talent level 5, does that help? Did I mess up by entering the zone with 8 spell levels the first time around, so GC became permanently hostile?

Do locked categories I can pick off escorts actually contribute to the count?

You see confused as to the trigger.
The Grand Corruptor is hostile even if you do have 11 spell talents.
All spell talents from any source will count.

HousePet wrote:You see confused as to the trigger.
The Grand Corruptor is hostile even if you do have 11 spell talents.
All spell talents from any source will count.

Sorry if I was vague, by hostile I meant GC not offering me to side with him even when I brought him down to 5% health. The first time it happened I left the zone and came back with more than 11 talent levels worth of spells (I think), and he STILL did not offer me to join him.

Which made me wonder if entering his lair with less than 11 spell levels (and taking him down to less than half health before exiting the zone) makes you unable to get the offer for the entire playthrough, regardless of whether you learn new spells down the road. Is that the case here?

I've done this quest many times before, this is the first time I've managed to botch it.

It would only trigger once when his health was low, if you had already done that and not got the option, it won't check again.

Ivels wrote:Okay, lets rephrase the question.

What is the minimum amount of work you need to do on a class that starts with no spells whatsoever to be able to qualify for the Hexes tree from GC?

Spend 11 generics on either an arcane escort's unlocked category or the Staff Combat tree (purchased unlocked at Angolwen). That's the simplest, most guaranteed way, though it's pretty expensive build-wise (particularly since your end goal is to unlock another generic tree). You can, of course, inscribe runes instead of spending generics, but category points are more valuable than generics.

Note, however, that if you are a Shalore, your racials count as spells, so points spent there count as well. Only Shalore talents count, though (yes, on top of being a madman bent on creating a second Spellblaze, the Grand Corrupter is a racist, as well).

Hard Mode: with as little dependency on escort spawns as possible

As I mentioned above, you're guaranteed access to Staff Combat (it even saves you a category point).

European Extreme Mode: without using more than 3 generic talent points

Okay, now things get interesting. First off, you can always juggle a few points: Unlearn three generics, put the points into Staff Combat, smack down the Grand Corrupter, then unlearn them when you get to Zigur. That gets you down to 7 generics permanently invested.

Even if you don't want to spend any category points, you can fill the three inscription slots you start with with runes and keep some decent infusions on hand to replace them later. That gets you down to 4 generic points.

You can always keep a staff as your alternate weapon and swap to it when the Corrupter is injured. Staves grant you Command Staff, which counts as a talent. Of course, it means that the already dangerous Grand Corrupter is now even harder; viability depends on the class (a Bulwark would be better served just spending another generic point, for instance). That takes you to 3 generic talent points (and zero category points) permanently invested.

If using a staff seems too risky, you can instead hope to find a volcanic, striking, or void wand, using the wand's granted talent to replace Command Staff. Unfortunately, such wands are not as guaranteed as a staff. Still, it doesn't hurt to check the shops, just in case (keep your eyes open for any short staves, as well; weapon talents are generally compatible with those).

Very helpful response, Mewtarthio! Getting the right gear is not exactly an issue, I wouldn't fight GC until finishing the majority of Maj'Eyal zones anyway. It's those generic and category points that matter. After all, if I'm planning to unlock hexes on a non-spellcaster (and if I wasn't, why would I care about siding with GC in the first place?), I'm already spreading my points a bit too thin.

So it's great news that spells granted through items and runes actually do count! Well done on beating European Extreme.

I thought the whole point was to destroy Zigur...