ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

Hi all,

I've been playing with a Cornac Archmage for a few weeks and i'm not sure my level is enough to take on the Master.
I confronted him once when i was level 26 and he decimated me.
From what i have read i should be level 35 or so to be safe.

So i made a new char, visited all available Tier1 and Tier2 zones and some special zones including:
- Temporal Rift
- Ring of Blood
- Master Assassin
- Lake Nur/Sher'Tul Fortress
- Tempest Peak
- A farportal expedition
- Last Hope Graveyard (bad idea btw, i lost 3 lives )
- I also hunted down several roaming adventurer parties, also a bad idea. Some were easy, some were insta-death.

After all of the above i barely made it to level 30. And because i was playing a Cornac. Imagine doing this with an xp penalty...

Is there some other safe zone with xp i am missing? Or is my level enough to take on the Master and proceed the main plot?

Thanx in advance!

Also check out the Ruined dungeon (the one with the puzzle orbs) and the golem graveyard. Not much xp there mind. Some do the Mark of the Spellblaze before the Master too.

But level 30 is enough. Level 25 is enough for many chars in fact. And you should gain a few levels going through Dreadfell itself. Your problem may be one of tactics. The Master fight is very long, so you need to conserve resources well and have lots of escape options when things go badly (wand of teleport helps a lot). What got you killed last time?

Thanks for the reply!
I'll check out all of these dungeons next time.

My first time :
The master was waiting near the stairs of lvl 9 in Dreadfell, summoned hordes of skeletons which stood on the stairs.
I casted several spell but got stunned, teleport,phase door disabled, skeletons critical = death.

Second time:
Last night though i managed to kill him after a really long fight. I was level 30
If it wasn't for probability travel and 80% stun immunity this would be impossible.
However i did lose my 2 last spare lives, so i still think i am underleveled or i just suck at choosing skills/playing safe.
The guy has 4K health, an extra life and usually hits for 400+ dmg. Shield goes down in the first turn and if a skelie hits me I'm dead.
Hide,seek and pray.

Got a link to your character sheet? Including the one that died? Maybe we can give some advice on build or where you might be going wrong.

The Master is the first properly hard fight in the game, and losing to him sometimes should not be considered a mark of failure (though I've never lost to him :P). But if you consistently struggle with him then you may have trouble progressing further into the game.

My general tactic is to teleport around a lot, ignore his minions where possible, get him one on one in a corridor and keep him stunned as much as possible. Avoid his spells too - step back from any you can see cast towards you. Make sure to use debuffs as much as possible, like the rod of annulment or a staff of ruination, and have ways of clearing nasty effects you get hit with.

I'm surprised you're getting stunned by skeletons at that level. Implies to me that your physical save is not very high, or that you do too weak damage to take them out in a decent space of time.

Agree with "teleport around a lot." I actually found the fight a little more fun when randomly and constantly porting around the dungeon wasn't the best strategy for taking out the summons (of which I think there are far too many, but I tend to play classes weak on AoE). I don't think the fight is possible without teleport.

Note that unless you farportal scum like mad and manage to outlevel Dreadfell, you are probably just going to make the Master tougher by challenging him at a higher level.

This was my first char to make it to the Master:
http://te4.org/characters/13173/tome/53 ... 8162430eb5

This is my current char. Only my last life left...
http://te4.org/characters/13173/tome/d3 ... 2918f5aee1

The path i usually take is:
Arcane:
Arcane Power - 1
Manathrust - 3 - for beam, secondary cheap beam spell
Manaflow - 1

Fire:
Flame - 5 main cheap beam spell no.1
Flameshock - 1 for stunning
Fireflash - 5 main aoe spell no.1 Used with arcane eye clears many rooms from afar

Air:
Lightning - 5 main cheap beam spell no.2
ChainLigthning - 0-5 I experimented with this one, but it seems overcosted.

Storm:
Nova - 5 main aoe spell no.2 Used with hurricane seems nice
Shock - 1 nice for dazing a single target or hurricaning it. Unfortunately bosses aren't affected that much.
Hurricane - 5 Currently experimenting with it. Interesting
Tempest - 5 Very nice for the resistance reduction,but each point gives only 2% extra damage.

Meta:
Spellcraft : 1-5 seems useful but i don't quite understand how it helps putting more than 1 point in it appart from dodging my fireballs.

Temporal: (Experimenting with this tree, seems nice but it's very costly)
Time Shield - 1 Ok, stacks with shielding.
Time Prison - 1-2 The reason i put a talent in the tree, but i never used it. 150 mana is too much.
Essence Of Speed - 0 sustained for 275 mana? where the hell am i go to find so much mana?

Conveyance
Phase door 1 - i don't trust the description "outside the line of sight there is a chance to fizzle" so i invest in teleport
Teleport 5 - to get far away in a targeted location
Displacement Shield - 5 Nice for boss fights
Probability Travel - 1 Just discovered how great this is. The master seems impossible without it.ofc it's expensive

Divination
Arcane eye 1 - Super useful spell. It states that it sees through invisibility and stealth at lvl 5 but i found that was not the case...
Keen Senses - 1-5 Neat for dealing with invisibles + minor crit chance.
Vision - 1 For mapping

Aegis
Healing - 1-2 Basic healing
Shielding - 2 It scales badly above 2
Arcane Shield - 0 Played with it for a while, don't like it.
Aegis - 2 nice but i rarely have the time to use it

Celestial / Light (I took this for the first time)
Healing Light - 1 Healing that uses no mana.
Bathe In Light - 1 Seems lame.
Barrier - Another shield, nice
Providence - Wow, very nice, but i can't use it while confused

With both characters you have ridiculously low Constitution, and thus very little HP. With only one weak shield rune then you are doomed against enemies capable of high burst damage (like The Master). Don't put so much in Willpower and give yourself better defence instead. Probability Travel is nice, but 5/5 Phase Door is a lot cheaper. You only need 1 point in Teleport really.

Get combat training from Last Hope, and when you pump Con invest points in Thick Skin - get this maxed! Put a point in armour training so you can wear metal too. And choose equipment with damage resistances.

Your offensive choices seem fine, though I'm not a fan of the Lightning tree myself. I am a big fan of Flameshock though - pump it up for longer stuns over a bigger area.

Last Hope training?
Never seen that. Where is the teacher?

About phase door:
as i wrote before i'm afraid of the "perhaps this will fizzle clause" that's why i maxed teleport instead.

About constitution:
I'll try to put some points into this.

There's a weapon shop in Last Hope that also sells training in general combat or archery.

The fizzling only happens if you aim in an unseen area, and even then it's a low chance and not that terrible. Teleport has a high range at 1/5 investment. Putting more points in lets you aim it, but I don't find much use in that myself - I'm comfortable in the knowledge that I'll likely end up far away.

I just noticed your nickname.
Grey...now that is a name i remember.
You are very active in the ADOM forums if you are the same person.
Thousands of posts there, thousands of posts here...
If so, you are a roguelike addict! Wow!

And a very helpful addict i must add


Edit:
And damn, i never visited weapon shops... i'm an archmage after all!

Yup, major roguelike addict here. I like making them too ;)

The weapons trainer ain't too obvious, unfortunately.

You could probably stand to invest more in the Aegis category and neglect the Storm category. Storm is fun but not very useful, especially when you aren't investing in the Air category. The dazes just don't work against the most dangerous enemies (damned immunities), and Archmages really don't need any help sweeping up weak foes. Hurricane can only proc if dazes land, and it cancels out the daze after one turn, so its very self-destructive. Granted, Nova + Hurricane on a room full of enemies is hilarious.

I've found Arcane Eye at level 4 useful for the Master or other hard bosses. Pin it on him and then you always know where he is (just remember to reapply it before it runs out). This allows you to hit him with AOE spells around corners before he has a chance to see/attack you. You can teleport away and then set up more ambushes without being in any real danger.

bricks wrote:You could probably stand to invest more in the Aegis category and neglect the Storm category. Storm is fun but not very useful, especially when you aren't investing in the Air category. The dazes just don't work against the most dangerous enemies (damned immunities), and Archmages really don't need any help sweeping up weak foes. Hurricane can only proc if dazes land, and it cancels out the daze after one turn, so its very self-destructive. Granted, Nova + Hurricane on a room full of enemies is hilarious.

Thanks for the advice, but i the Aegis category is Generic while the Storm category is Class.
As far as i know i cannot spend points from one category to another. Or can I?

Anyhow, it seems that only a few people like the lightning/storm tree.
Should i try the Wildfire approach? Its spells seem weird.

In a future char i would like to experiment with the Cold tree instead of lightning, it seems powerful.
But i can't find the Earth/Stone tree appealing.

@rjrrt:
This is indeed an interesting use of Arcane Eye.

Sorry, I didn't mean "in place of." Two bits of advice kind of mashed together.