My ideas for making the "war on orcs" much more engaging.
Posted: Thu May 26, 2016 6:28 pm
I like ToME very much and think it's an awesome game. Especially the huge community of people who develop and keep the game awesome is astounding.
The game itself is so much fun, I really like every bit of it, at least in the early parts.
However, when I get to the east I find myself actually losing my enthusiasm. I force myself to play through the game, keeping sessions short, saying to myself "just the Vor Pride today then I go do something else". Maybe that's a good thing? But I really wish this part of the game, the whole lategame, that it would just be able to keep my interest and zeal a bit more.
I think what might be behind this is the mere fact, that this grand and epic war against the orcs doesn't really feel much like what It's hyped up to be.
That's unfortunate.
Here's a quick summary of my enthusiasm levels for an overview:
- Early parts: Awesome, I like it!
- Only things left to do being Mark of the Spellblaze, Melissa, and Dreadfell: This isn't as nice!
- Early part of the war on orcs: This is amazing, I am going through all these orcs and Aeryn gave me a fitting talent for my relentlessness!
- Later parts after you return. Uggh, what a slugfest.....
I think what happens here is that the prides are furstrating dungeons to go through. I doesn't really feel like a war as there's no flavor text anymore and you do not see anything change. The bit of text from Aeryn after defeating all the prides is lousy to say the least and the orc patrols still spawn, which makes it look ridiculous.
So I would like to suggest some ideas I have for the whole portion of the later game. I actually made a topic using an older account and DG himself answered in it. However with 1.4 having been released nothing about this changed. Which is fair enough, but for me I find it somewhat disappointing, as I think some of these things would go a long way to keep the game more exciting and engaging in the endgame and not upset balance in any meaningful way. It's somewhat more like flavor and that is why I want to suggest my ideas in a better layout once more. First I'll start with an overview of the main themes, I think are weighing down the experience.
"BREEDING PITS": Remember them? They were removed by DG. Yeah, it maybe was for the better, but, it made the east feel even more barren and the orc patrols are relentless. And now you have nothing to lower their frequency of occurence. This makes no sense, as the theme of raiding orc homes is still there when you look at the layouts of the prides. Those are houses! But if you clear a pride, Orc Patrols still do spawn from it and there is literally nothing that suggests any change of the balance of power on the world map.
ORC PATROLS: These are just unfair most of the time and I do not understand why they have to be such an uncontrollable and unmitigatable part of the experience, anyway, even independent from the flavor concerns they bring up when still spawning from cleared prides. Either they end your character unfairly or they will get scummed for experience and nice loot. Sometimes they are just annoying, but there is nothing really good about them. That is why most of my following suggestions have to do with reducing or weakening Orc Patrols and also buffing and increasing the number of Sunwall Patrols as the war swings in their favor.
Suggestion for Lore: More Flavor Text, even somewhat filler-like might be nice.
For example: have some more dialogue from Aeryn or have maybe a few speech bubbles from townsfolk about important events in the war, like the opening of a farportal to the west or killing of the prides: just some flavor text would be nice to go along with our many achievements in the east.
Suggestion for Gameplay: reduce/weaken the orc patrols and increase/buff the Sunwall patrols.
When you first get to the east, the situation looks bleak and hopeless. However, when you arrive there you already will have done some very nice things for the Sunwall. So the first impression you get actually isn't even close to what the Sunwall had suffered through, before your character was born/decided to go adventuring.
- Maybe, the first awesome thing you did, is killing the orc ambush and their leader (...maybe).
- You killed Golbug in Reknor and destroyed the orc presence in the west, which cuts of any trade or supply routes the orcs had to Maj'Eyal. They lost convenience and also an Orb of Many Ways
- You saved Fillarel:and killed another major orc (whose name eludes me).
Suggestions:
Orc ambush: If you manage to defeat it, you should get a reward for doing so: As they have lost a whole corps as well as three major leaders (which includes the ambush leader, golbug and that orc who threatens Fillarel), the # of orc patrols should be decreased by 1 permanently right from the start, giving you some extra breathing room as soon as you arrive in the east.
Ardhungol: Saving the Sun Paladin would increase Sunwall patrols by one, as a powerful general returns and rejoins their ranks.
Vor Armoury: If you clear it out, it deprives the orcs of weapons and armor. This leads to powerful Orc Berserkers and fighters being unable to obtain weapons, forcing them to stay home (i.e. they're removed from the RNG that determings what spawns in a patrol)
Opening trade with the West: Now the Sunwall have supplies, manpower and weapons which they get from their allies in the West! This should increase the "power" of the sunwall patrol units... I don't know what the exact mechanics behing the "patrol fights" are, but if it is something like a chance of who wins, then increase the odds for the Sunwall winning a bit.
Bonus: Doing this could set off a re-roll of the Sunwall stores. The store would re-roll as a "stage 3 re-roll" like after the Charred Scar. This could be instead of Charred Scar reroll or in addition to it. It's not overpowered, because the gear competes with drops and the randart merchant, thus it would be more a nice touch.
Dark Crypt: Clearing the Dark Crypt deprives the orcs of surplus Necromancers, removing them from Patrols.
The Prides: As you know, the prides is where the patrols actually spawn from. So, after clearing them out (going into their houses and stuff), it makes no sense for them to still spawn from them.
- Every pride you clear ceases further spawning of patrols. The number of Orc Patrols on the map may only be at most one more than the total number of uncleared prides at any point.
BONUS: The Sunwall will increase their boldness and wander around the areas where Orc Prides used to be (I suggest this, because the Sunwall Patrols seem to only move around the actual Gates of Morning and dare not move much further).
- If you did not defeat the Orc ambush you would start with 5 patrols on the world map
- If you defeated the ambush you would start with 4 patrols on the world map
- every cleared pride then reduces the number of patrols by one.
- after ALL prides are taken down, all Orc Patrols will be immediately wiped from the map and the Sunwall Patrols can be seen roaming freely across the entire eastern world map. This would feel like an awesome achievement.
Of course the Orcs aren't completely gone, but they're in disarray, waiting patiently for their chance in the Embers of Rage!
So what do you think? It would be awesome to see this in 1.5
It really would add some value to a part of the game, many people would agree on is kind of boring. So let's push the idea. Add your own or comment!
Cheers!
The game itself is so much fun, I really like every bit of it, at least in the early parts.
However, when I get to the east I find myself actually losing my enthusiasm. I force myself to play through the game, keeping sessions short, saying to myself "just the Vor Pride today then I go do something else". Maybe that's a good thing? But I really wish this part of the game, the whole lategame, that it would just be able to keep my interest and zeal a bit more.
I think what might be behind this is the mere fact, that this grand and epic war against the orcs doesn't really feel much like what It's hyped up to be.
That's unfortunate.
Here's a quick summary of my enthusiasm levels for an overview:
- Early parts: Awesome, I like it!
- Only things left to do being Mark of the Spellblaze, Melissa, and Dreadfell: This isn't as nice!
- Early part of the war on orcs: This is amazing, I am going through all these orcs and Aeryn gave me a fitting talent for my relentlessness!
- Later parts after you return. Uggh, what a slugfest.....
I think what happens here is that the prides are furstrating dungeons to go through. I doesn't really feel like a war as there's no flavor text anymore and you do not see anything change. The bit of text from Aeryn after defeating all the prides is lousy to say the least and the orc patrols still spawn, which makes it look ridiculous.
So I would like to suggest some ideas I have for the whole portion of the later game. I actually made a topic using an older account and DG himself answered in it. However with 1.4 having been released nothing about this changed. Which is fair enough, but for me I find it somewhat disappointing, as I think some of these things would go a long way to keep the game more exciting and engaging in the endgame and not upset balance in any meaningful way. It's somewhat more like flavor and that is why I want to suggest my ideas in a better layout once more. First I'll start with an overview of the main themes, I think are weighing down the experience.
"BREEDING PITS": Remember them? They were removed by DG. Yeah, it maybe was for the better, but, it made the east feel even more barren and the orc patrols are relentless. And now you have nothing to lower their frequency of occurence. This makes no sense, as the theme of raiding orc homes is still there when you look at the layouts of the prides. Those are houses! But if you clear a pride, Orc Patrols still do spawn from it and there is literally nothing that suggests any change of the balance of power on the world map.
ORC PATROLS: These are just unfair most of the time and I do not understand why they have to be such an uncontrollable and unmitigatable part of the experience, anyway, even independent from the flavor concerns they bring up when still spawning from cleared prides. Either they end your character unfairly or they will get scummed for experience and nice loot. Sometimes they are just annoying, but there is nothing really good about them. That is why most of my following suggestions have to do with reducing or weakening Orc Patrols and also buffing and increasing the number of Sunwall Patrols as the war swings in their favor.
Suggestion for Lore: More Flavor Text, even somewhat filler-like might be nice.
For example: have some more dialogue from Aeryn or have maybe a few speech bubbles from townsfolk about important events in the war, like the opening of a farportal to the west or killing of the prides: just some flavor text would be nice to go along with our many achievements in the east.
Suggestion for Gameplay: reduce/weaken the orc patrols and increase/buff the Sunwall patrols.
When you first get to the east, the situation looks bleak and hopeless. However, when you arrive there you already will have done some very nice things for the Sunwall. So the first impression you get actually isn't even close to what the Sunwall had suffered through, before your character was born/decided to go adventuring.
- Maybe, the first awesome thing you did, is killing the orc ambush and their leader (...maybe).
- You killed Golbug in Reknor and destroyed the orc presence in the west, which cuts of any trade or supply routes the orcs had to Maj'Eyal. They lost convenience and also an Orb of Many Ways
- You saved Fillarel:and killed another major orc (whose name eludes me).
Suggestions:
Orc ambush: If you manage to defeat it, you should get a reward for doing so: As they have lost a whole corps as well as three major leaders (which includes the ambush leader, golbug and that orc who threatens Fillarel), the # of orc patrols should be decreased by 1 permanently right from the start, giving you some extra breathing room as soon as you arrive in the east.
Ardhungol: Saving the Sun Paladin would increase Sunwall patrols by one, as a powerful general returns and rejoins their ranks.
Vor Armoury: If you clear it out, it deprives the orcs of weapons and armor. This leads to powerful Orc Berserkers and fighters being unable to obtain weapons, forcing them to stay home (i.e. they're removed from the RNG that determings what spawns in a patrol)
Opening trade with the West: Now the Sunwall have supplies, manpower and weapons which they get from their allies in the West! This should increase the "power" of the sunwall patrol units... I don't know what the exact mechanics behing the "patrol fights" are, but if it is something like a chance of who wins, then increase the odds for the Sunwall winning a bit.
Bonus: Doing this could set off a re-roll of the Sunwall stores. The store would re-roll as a "stage 3 re-roll" like after the Charred Scar. This could be instead of Charred Scar reroll or in addition to it. It's not overpowered, because the gear competes with drops and the randart merchant, thus it would be more a nice touch.
Dark Crypt: Clearing the Dark Crypt deprives the orcs of surplus Necromancers, removing them from Patrols.
The Prides: As you know, the prides is where the patrols actually spawn from. So, after clearing them out (going into their houses and stuff), it makes no sense for them to still spawn from them.
- Every pride you clear ceases further spawning of patrols. The number of Orc Patrols on the map may only be at most one more than the total number of uncleared prides at any point.
BONUS: The Sunwall will increase their boldness and wander around the areas where Orc Prides used to be (I suggest this, because the Sunwall Patrols seem to only move around the actual Gates of Morning and dare not move much further).
- If you did not defeat the Orc ambush you would start with 5 patrols on the world map
- If you defeated the ambush you would start with 4 patrols on the world map
- every cleared pride then reduces the number of patrols by one.
- after ALL prides are taken down, all Orc Patrols will be immediately wiped from the map and the Sunwall Patrols can be seen roaming freely across the entire eastern world map. This would feel like an awesome achievement.
Of course the Orcs aren't completely gone, but they're in disarray, waiting patiently for their chance in the Embers of Rage!
So what do you think? It would be awesome to see this in 1.5
It really would add some value to a part of the game, many people would agree on is kind of boring. So let's push the idea. Add your own or comment!
Cheers!
