ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

A quote from the chat just now as I logged in: "I'd donate, right now, on the spot If I got an extra life out ofit." (original typos included). Just figured that some technique to "rescue" dead characters into Explorer mode or something similar might have an appeal to some people.

Hah, that's actually a great idea IMO. Few Euros for an extra life might generate some extra funds for sure.

This sounds like it would be a jump off the slippery slope into pay to win territory. I would very much recommend against it.

King Gainer, you misunderstand. Any donator can already play in Explorer mode - giving them infinite lives from the very beginning. I'm not saying that you should be giving them extra lives while still having the character register as Roguelike - that would taint an important part of the game pretty quickly. I'm just saying that if someone's gotten invested in a character, and is *this* close to winning, the opportunity to, in essence, retroactively have picked Explorer mode, might be worth something to them. Possibly make it a new mode - "Rescued" or some such. Replace the Eidolon with a darker patron who comments about how clearly someone powerful owes you favors, and he's prepared to put you back together and send you back (in the Eidolon way) even though he personally has no real fondness for mortals. Then keep track of how many times they died after being recovered. There are any number of ways to spin it, and I'm likely not the best person to come up with them - but I don't think that anyone is really bragging about how far they got in Explorer mode anyway.

On one hand, I can sorta' see it. Having an option to drop from a higher difficulty/stricter permadeath setting into a lower/looser one on death would be... interesting, I guess. I wouldn't entirely mind seeing it in the standard game.

On the other hand, we kinda' have adventurer mode, and explorer mode in the case of donators. If folks want to have extra lives, well, they can play those. A zero death victory in advn. or explorer is the same as a victory in roguelike, really.

Sirrocco wrote:A quote from the chat just now as I logged in: "I'd donate, right now, on the spot If I got an extra life out ofit." (original typos included). Just figured that some technique to "rescue" dead characters into Explorer mode or something similar might have an appeal to some people.

Might as well admit the person you're quoting is me. Apologies for the typo. Context related to a ridiculously stupid death to miskey on the hotbar... While I don't want to see lives for pay, I can kinda see dropping into a lower mode. Seems like more people would ATTEMPT roguelike if they could drop into adventurer on death, if it was a character they really liked.

Changing game modes in the middle of the game is ridiculous. Why have game modes at all? Just call zero-death wins "roguelike winners."

bricks wrote:Changing game modes in the middle of the game is ridiculous. Why have game modes at all? Just call zero-death wins "roguelike winners."

And give the roguelike achievement version if you have no deaths when you grab the achievement.

It's for the challenge of it. By playing Roguelike you know that you don't have any fallbacks if you die. If you play Adventurer, then you're always aware that you have those extra lives. That lets you take more risks, confident that you always have the ultimate contingency waiting in the Eidolon plane. Roguelike players need to be cautious throughout. A no-death Adventurer win means that all your gambles paid off. A Roguelike win means you minimized the number of gambles you had to make in the first place.

This would defeat the purpose of the 3 different modes anyway, because I would always play roguelike and if I die I drop to a lower mode anyway.

Donating for an extra life is buying power by the way.

The whole point of roguelike mode is the innate tension of knowing that any serious mistake or misjudgement could get you permanently killed. Having an on-death option of "hey, wanna just drop into another difficulty mode?" would ruin that feel a bit, in my opinion.

Grey wrote:The whole point of roguelike mode is the innate tension of knowing that any serious mistake or misjudgement could get you permanently killed. Having an on-death option of "hey, wanna just drop into another difficulty mode?" would ruin that feel a bit, in my opinion.

Perhaps this option doesn't get offered in roguelike, only in adventure?

Same issue applies with getting standard achievements compared to explorer achievements, ergo, same argument would apply.

There are no achievements in Explorer mode.

In general the "pay for another life" thing is something strongly frowned upon in roguelike circles. If anything like this were to be implemented it would have to be done very very carefully to avoid a vicious backlash.

Grey wrote:There are no achievements in Explorer mode.

In general the "pay for another life" thing is something strongly frowned upon in roguelike circles. If anything like this were to be implemented it would have to be done very very carefully to avoid a vicious backlash.

*ALL* achievements are available in Explorer mode. They tagged explorer mode.