ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

Should ToME have auto-explore? Why? How should it behave?

Let your voice be heard (and please be constructive).

Well it wouldn't be a negative feature to have, but I'd rather have time spent on more interesting dungeon generators. Also I get the impression that the biggest reason people want auto-explore is because of Trollmire, which time and again many have complained about. Let that problem be addressed directly.

Grey wrote:Well it wouldn't be a negative feature to have, but I'd rather have time spent on more interesting dungeon generators. Also I get the impression that the biggest reason people want auto-explore is because of Trollmire, which time and again many have complained about. Let that problem be addressed directly.

Valid points, all, and I agree more interesting dungeons should be worked on. This isn't an either/or proposition, though, and I support many of your recent posts, Grey, and I hope you keep posting (or start coding ).

I could probably add auto-explore to ToME with an hour of work, and I don't think I could spice of dungeons in that amount of time (and I should return to my other project, which has sat nearly finished for too long). Anyway, I was hoping for some feedback before I wrote auto-explore, 'cause I don't want to waste my time.

If you think you can do it an hour tiger eye I see no reason not to do it.

Auto-explore, in my opinion, ought to be in every rogue-like game. For those who want to explore every nook and cranny, and make sure EVERYTHING has been located, auto-explore cuts down immensely on tedium -- once you've explored the majority of a floor, navigating to the untouched areas is just a time-sink, and by definition, time-sinks aren't fun.

Whenever I start playing ToME after having played Dungeon Crawl Stone Soup (I tend to alternate between the two as I get frustrated with one or the other) I always get annoyed at not having the autoexplore function. Especially in the areas with a lot of obscuring terrain scattered around.

I'd like it, especially if it somehow doesn't penalise cursed too much. Cause that's one thing I hate about cursed. I'm a completionist, and I can't really "finish" the dungeon without losing loads of hate.

Cursed hate regen looks to be vastly improved in the next version, something like a melee version of Feed (via the Stalking skill). Entering a battle running hot should still be advantageous but not a requirement.

If you can code up something decent then I don't see why it wouldn't be included (at least as a toggleable option, if not a core feature) Its something I enjoyed immensely whilst playing Xenocide (A sci-fi themed roguelike that was never finished) and would like to see it added to T.O.M.E

What would be really awesome would be an auto explore feature that can be set up to explore, light, and vision and rest up automatically

I agree, when I get back to ToME from Dungeon Crawl I always miss auto-explore immensly.

Some reasons for auto-explore:

1. Persistent dungeons encourage exploring every nook and cranny. In the end you start squinting at the mini-map trying to find any black squares to clean-up and move back and forth. Not very fun.

2. Some dungeons are very boring to explore like the Maze.

3. Even for other dungeons, auto-explore removes a boring, non-skilled, repetitive task: Using numerous clicks/keystrokes in order to move to the nearest unexplored black square. Thus it increase the proportion of fun combat time comparing to grinding menial labor.

4. If someone does not like it, then one can avoid using it. Thus it is an optional feature.

Have been discussed previously here:
http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=36&t=28895
http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=46&t=25608

The last also discusses implementation somewhat: I would prefer to have auto-explore also incorporate resting. That is, when you press the auto-explore button you first rest until completely healed before starting moving.

In short, I personally think auto-explore is the most significant improvement that can be made to ToME. It is one of those things that when you have tried it, you do not know how you managed without it before.

Also preferably, if an unidentified object is found then auto-explore should stop when on top of it. Obviously if a monster is seen auto-explore should stop immediately.

Mithril wrote:Also preferably, if an unidentified object is found then auto-explore should stop when on top of it. Obviously if a monster is seen auto-explore should stop immediately.

My idea of how it would work makes that an intrinsic part of it, as it is part of running. My pseudo-pseudo-code of auto-explore (tell me if I'm right here):

Find nearest unexplored tile
Run to it
If there are unexplored tiles, repeat
else stop.

If it is interrupted in the "running" stage, it would also stop. I support having this feature, as the absolute worst that could happen with its inclusion is that I ignore it.

Other key points:

-never open doors
-stop if damage taken
-stop if companions take damage

In general how should it behave with pets? Could be an awful nuisance.

And I hope by default it's on a key like shift+a. I wouldn't want to accidentally press the wrong key with an escort around.

Grey wrote:Other key points:

-never open doors
-stop if damage taken
-stop if companions take damage

In general how should it behave with pets? Could be an awful nuisance.

And I hope by default it's on a key like shift+a. I wouldn't want to accidentally press the wrong key with an escort around.

Personally I think it should be disabled if you have an escort quest.

Pets should function similarly as to how pets function for running.

Regarding which key to use. Shift-a as the default is fine if this means auto-explore is implemented. But I think almost all people will use auto-explore extensively after they have tried so it will become a single key by default eventually. It will likely be one of the most used keys/buttons for most player so using the shift key will get awkward and tiring for the hands.

I already rebind many of the keys so I guess that's not a problem.

Ultimately the implementation shouldn't be that hard, since the path-finding system with interruptions is already in place for running. All that's needed is the "find the nearest unexplored square" function. In this respect I think the system should cheat a little to find the nearest unexplored floor square, to prevent it taking you halfway across the map because there's a corner wall tile you didn't fully reveal. Once it finds the square it just implements the run-to function as if you'd clicked on that square on the map or minimap.

Ultimately this belongs in the engine functions, as I'm sure many modules would like to use it.