ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

Based on this and this. Sometimes, a monster will die in an undiggable wall, dropping loot there. This is a pain, especially if it's an artifact.

So, I suggest that when using the 'get' command, it check adjacent squares and let you grab any objects that are embedded in a wall -- yanking them out of the wall or whatever. Alternatively, displace them onto an adjacent open space.

This used to be a minor issue, but recent changes to Daikara have made it much more likely to happen, because Daikara now has a lot of undiggable walls -- combined with, frequently, one of the few bosses capable of walking through walls.

In fact, Daikara is kind of a very bad level to put undiggable walls in, since it's a place with a lot of monsters capable of passing through walls. Personally, I'd suggest making Daikara entirely-diggable, even the vaults -- while it has vaults, they all have obvious walls that are clearly visually distinct structures separated from everything else in the level, so you only have yourself to blame if you breach one.

But basically, the current combination of undiggable walls + many monsters that pass through walls (including a boss) in Daikara is annoying.

(Another solution would be to forbid monsters that can pass through walls from entering walls that aren't diggable, I guess.)

Yet another solution would be to only allow unpassable/undiggable walls in vaults.

Hum, I'm not sure I understand the problem. If an enemy can move through a tile, then you should be able to dig the tile to get any loot that dropped on it. All zone tiles should be like this, and non-passable, non-diggable terrain are typically used for vaults.

So, exactly when and how is this not the case? Do "mountain chain" tiles actually show up in Daikara and elsewhere? If so, I would regard that as a bug and would like to know details about the level (such as if there is a vault somewhere). "mountain chain" tiles should only show up on the worldmap, 'cause they are passable, but not diggable (which is fine on the worldmap).

My lack of understanding aside, I wouldn't mind if loot from enemies in blocked tiles would drop to a nearest unblocked adjacent tile if possible, which has been suggested before.

tiger_eye wrote:Hum, I'm not sure I understand the problem. If an enemy can move through a tile, then you should be able to dig the tile to get any loot that dropped on it. All zone tiles should be like this, and non-passable, non-diggable terrain are typically used for vaults.

So, exactly when and how is this not the case? Do "mountain chain" tiles actually show up in Daikara and elsewhere? If so, I would regard that as a bug and would like to know details about the level (such as if there is a vault somewhere). "mountain chain" tiles should only show up on the worldmap, 'cause they are passable, but not diggable (which is fine on the worldmap).

My lack of understanding aside, I wouldn't mind if loot from enemies in blocked tiles would drop to a nearest unblocked adjacent tile if possible, which has been suggested before.

Read the threads I linked to! Mountain chains now occur in Daikara, and are undiggable but allow monsters capable of passing through walls (which are relatively common in Daikara) to enter them and die in them, dropping loot that can't be recovered by any means.

A similar issue that I ran into is items on top of teleport traps. I couldn't disarm them with my wand, and every time I stepped on it, I was teleported away. The only way on is through a talent like Reckless Charge.

Perhaps there could be a spell that allows you to pick up items at a distance (even inside walls), cast by 'Gloves of Apportation' or some similar ego? Though, it should probably have limited range and require line of sight, so you can't use it to safely loot vaults or anything like that.

Aquillion wrote:Read the threads I linked to! Mountain chains now occur in Daikara, and are undiggable but allow monsters capable of passing through walls (which are relatively common in Daikara) to enter them and die in them, dropping loot that can't be recovered by any means.

Yes, I read those, and I have been unable to reproduce it despite generating 30+ levels of Daikara. It was unclear to me from those posts that "Mountain Chains" are always the culprit, so more specific details could be useful, 'cause this sounds like a bug. "Mountain Chain"--a wilderness grid--shouldn't occur in Daikara.

For me it's the other way around. In all the Daikara's I did recently, I could not find a single diggable tile. For me, it seems all Daikara walls are undiggable. You can dig them, sure, you will dig for (insert pickaxe speed here) turns, but nothing happens, the tile does not change and is still impassable mountain.

Popping in to say my experience in Daikara is that same as martin -- nearly the entire zone is undiggable.

I think a good solution would be a check to see if monsters location is unpassable, if it is drop its loot to the nearest passable spot.