ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

I don't get it, it's like Roll with It before getting hit, without the free movement and without the movement speed boost. I get a turn just before getting hit, right? When reading the description I thought it worked like Time Stop level 1, when, you know, time resumes after 1 action and nobody can act before you act a second time, but whatever I do with that "free" turn, the enemies move and act immediately after my free action. I just get to choose whether I want to dodge the bullet or tank it, it's sooo much not worth it. Granted, there's even worse prodigies, like Fast as Lightning, but at least Fast as Lightning is unique in that there's no talent like it in the main game, while Automated Reflex System is comparable to a class talent and it's worse than that talent at level 1.

Btw, friendly temporal clones' shots can trigger it, it also triggers whenever a bolt is in radius 1 from you but won't actually hit you so at least it's got those two things going for it I guess.

while i am not good a player enough to answer if there is a point or worth to it, i can answer the mechanical difference.

game turns are based on "energy", which while regained at the same rate by players and all mobs and npcs, it is expended at different values. your turn, is whenever your "energy" is at or above certain value.
every action, takes certain amount of energy which is based on your global speed, relevant (weapon, spell, mind) speed, as well as talents individual speed (for example skirmisher's swift shot)

"time stop" gives you set ammount of this energy, which is more than enough for an action or two, and still have a leftover, before you are forced to wait until you are at 0 again.

automated reflexes, most likely (i don't own embers, and tome tips doesn't have a "view source on it. guess don't want people to copy from there) puts your energy exactly at 0, allowing you to act at that moment, but you are still having to wait for the WHOLE duration of the action speed of the action you made, before you can act again.

as i said, i am not a pro, so you don't have to care about what i write next, but i will write it anyway.

roll with it requires you to get hit, and gives you a chance to either go back to where you were knocked away from, or to go further.
automated reflexes, allows you to negate the damage completely, and potentially take a double turn for a stupid combo.
keep it mind that ALL cooldowns, ALL actions, happen sort of in the same time frame.
there is no "action points", to spend, all enemies have to wait their turn, all projectiles move at a set speed relative to the global time.
that means, you can take an action, and have a projectile trigger your reflexes, 0.01 of a turn later.

for timestop to work, you need to already have a turn, and then activate it.
automated reflexes act on their own, whenever they are needed, regardless of the situation you are from.
no, i don't care about "emergency spell" sustain. it doesn't count, since it means you can sustain another spell. AR don't deny anything.

god damn it, actually start to think about it and suddenly i start having opinions...

The way ARS works kinda means on average it gives you a half a turn extra :p Since there's no controlling if you'll get the free energy reset while you were right about to take your next turn or immediately after your previous turn happened.

Possibility : make it give the player a completely free turn. Aka save the player energy score to be the same after you take the ARS action.

Wut ?
ARS gives a full turn worth of energy, in addition to whatever you currently add.

as i said, i don't own, so i can't check to be sure. could only guess, based on what was provided.

i blame him.

Peppersauce wrote:...but whatever I do with that "free" turn, the enemies move and act immediately after my free action

although the rest of my analysis still apply. i think.

Honestly, since I found out I can exploit both my temporal clones and bolts that I can already see and dodge from afar (as far as I'm seeing it, the talent gets activated whenever a bolt is in range 1, doesn't matter if it's targeting your current tile or not, probably not the intended behavior but I'll take it) I'm kind of liking this talent more. I can see the use of it, like to avoid a pesky Soul Rot crit. Fact is, even with the huge speed bonuses I'm packing as a TW I rarely get to act twice from it, while a character without those bonuses will never be able to do that and Time Stop level 1 guarantees you 2 actions before the enemy. Sure, you can't deal damage during Time Stop's duration but that's a non issue due to the nature of the class, which makes me wish I'd have taken a better prodigy instead. Then again, maybe I'm just using the wrong class for it and maybe it's really good coupled with, say, Brawler's bullet dodging thing.

darkgod wrote:Wut ?
ARS gives a full turn worth of energy, in addition to whatever you currently add.

Isn't this about as good as Windtouched Speed in the best case? And Windtouched Speed is really bad for a prodigy. The opportunity cost (of having a better prodigy) is high enough to make Automated Reflex System never a good choice.

automated reflex system is a very, very good prodigy for skirmishers and archers

no longer will skirmishers need to be afraid to use bash-n-smash or the shoot talent against enemies that can move the player in a way other than by knocking him away from him, and no longer will archers gunslingers and psyshots fear using almost any talent they have except crafted shells against enemies who can deflect projectiles teleport you or pull you towards them, in both cases unless of course other projectiles are being aimed at the player and not being dodged

i assume this prodigy activates when a prodigy is 1 tile away from the player character

but either way you've still gotta be careful not to use a projectile attack other than level 4-5 distortion bolt against an adjacent enemy who can cast fearscape, as when that enemy dies, you're teleported to his location(i lost a psyshot that way, my vital shot hit me), I'm not sure if automated reflex system would activate soon enough or not

in fact, I think that if the origin of the projectile is the player character, then it should both bypass the cooldown and not trigger it, or maybe archers gunslingers and psyshots should just get a talent that gives 100% projectile deflection chance at raw level 5 instead in a new class cunning category that they all share

Sorry to burst your bubble, Zeyphor, but I just checked the code and guess what condition the talent has? If the projectile's source is the player itself the prodigy won't trigger

"100% projectile deflection chance"?!
its like 100% immunity to multiple damage types.
or having -100% fatigue!
or that negative status effects just dont hapnen to you!

you are just erasing an entire part of the game!

you cant have 100%!!!

edit
well, if you were the source, and the talent doesn't check direction and if it matches with your position, then it would trigger every time you shoot, as soon as its off cooldown.

Radon26 wrote:"100% projectile deflection chance"?!
its like 100% immunity to multiple damage types.
or having -100% fatigue!
or that negative status effects just dont hapnen to you!

you are just erasing an entire part of the game!

you cant have 100%!!!

Agreed, but on the other hand the idea itself is not bad, it would work just fine if it was immunity from self-inflicted bullet damage.

Hey, if ARS had something like that added in it would actually be a cool prodigy for ranged classes.

Peppersauce wrote:Sorry to burst your bubble, Zeyphor, but I just checked the code and guess what condition the talent has? If the projectile's source is the player itself the prodigy won't trigger

well i guess the prodigy is garbage then peppersauce

if the prodigy doesn't check direction in which the projectile is going, it would trigger as soon as you shoot, regardless of danger, meaning it would deny its intended function. dodging.

Radon26 wrote:if the prodigy doesn't check direction in which the projectile is going, it would trigger as soon as you shoot, regardless of danger, meaning it would deny its intended function. dodging.

It really doesn't check direction tho. As I said, shots from temporal clones trigger it, and I had none of those fire at me for some reason.
The only checks on the projectile are "source is not the user" and "is in range 1".

Zeyphor wrote:no longer will skirmishers need to be afraid to use bash-n-smash or the shoot talent against enemies that can move the player in a way other than by knocking him away from him, and no longer will archers gunslingers and psyshots fear using almost any talent they have except crafted shells against enemies who can deflect projectiles teleport you or pull you towards them, in both cases unless of course other projectiles are being aimed at the player and not being dodged

Hmm, I haven't tested my Stop Hitting Yourself! addon with any of the Embers classes, but if they use the standard projectile infrastructure, I think it will cover you.