ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

Does anyone actually spend a category point to unlock the Cunning/Survival tree?

Looking at a couple of older posts, it doesn't really seem to be the case. This is a tree I would probably dump a few points into with every build--I do on every class that has it unlocked from start--but I would never spend a category point to unlock it, which tends to shoehorn the generic points and stat points elsewhere.

I'm curious what the rationale is for having it locked. Trap Handling really just slightly alleviates one of the game's few annoying features. At least one point in Heightened Senses is something I want on every character, and I always end up disappointed if I haven't gotten a rogue escort by the time I go west. Not sure how useful the new Piercing Sight talent is, though I don't think I'd put points in it. Evasion is the one that seems like it could have the biggest game impact and maybe justify the tree being locked, though I've never actually really used it as I haven't much played classes very far into the game that have both a high cunning investment and the tree unlocked from start (anyway it seems like a strange fit for the tree--I'd think Track would make more sense for the spot, as the tree is otherwise more conceptually focused on detection abilities).

Thoughts?

kazak wrote: Evasion is the one that seems like it could have the biggest game impact and maybe justify the tree being locked, though I've never actually really used it as I haven't much played classes very far into the game that have both a high cunning investment and the tree unlocked from start (anyway it seems like a strange fit for the tree--I'd think Track would make more sense for the spot, as the tree is otherwise more conceptually focused on detection abilities).

I agree with Track making more thematic sense in that tree (and likewise evasion sounds more fitting for field control).

As to the tree being locked at birth I'm not sure if many people will spend a point to unlock it. Maybe if traps were more dangerous rather then tedious.

I still can't imagine people putting generics into it... Remember that few classes have enough cunning to access the higher tiers.

Personally I'd say it should be unlocked on all, but Heightened Senses should be moved up in tiers so only those with high cunning (rogues) have easy access to it.

I generally like to have a point in Trap Handling--it's really nice for when the summoning traps start showing up (especially in farportal zones).

Heightened Senses is one I'm always really pissed if I don't get a point there. I recently had a yeek corrupter up to level 50 without a single point there and found myself spamming arcane eye in dreadfell to find the archers that kept staying just out of my light radius in one of the vaults with long corridors. Tedious, but not worth the cost of a teleport or movement inscription. With the tree unlocked, I probably would've maxed it (corrupters generally have high cunning and lots of generics anyway). I'd try to get at least a point on every character anyway.

And I kind of have this idea in my head that it would be awesome if the tree were unlocked, Track moved to one of the higher tiers, and then Grey's idea of moving adventurers into regular dungeons was implemented. That way we add some randomization (which everyone was talking about the past couple weeks), maybe fix some perceived problems with alchemist quests and adventurer parties, introduce more difficulty and challenge, but also make detection more available to balance the increase in difficulty. Of course, then there is the issue in Grey's comment that few classes push cunning that high. Hmmm...