ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Fri Feb 14, 2020 11:47 am 
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Halfling

Joined: Sun Aug 24, 2014 7:09 am
Posts: 105
Location: A Holding Pattern on the Eidolon Plane
Further notes:

Orbit does unkind things to the Sandworm Queen. A minion-reliant boss in tight quarters is ripe for adjacency shenanigans. Attaching Orbit to one of the friendly digging sandworms was also really helpful for breaching into rooms. It also seems like it'd have some hilarious interactions with on-hit effects.

It's interesting to me that the Starslinger uses a one-handed weapon and has nothing in particular to do with the off-hand. You can grab shield training and carry a shield (Str for physpower helps with some of the attacks anyway), get a lucky ritual knife to boost Dark or Light damage, or put a Wardstone in the off-hand. Truth be told this is the first time I've comfortably found a use for a wardstone.

The negative energy scaling on Disciple of Dusk seems... poor. One point gives 1.0 per kill, then another point gives... 1.2? I understand that there's another benefit, but the burst-on-crit doesn't seem terribly strong either, the bursts are only looking at 17 damage with two points in and 34 Spellpower (44 current Magic, level 21, for reference). Restful Night and, situationally, Nocturnal Raid seem like the stars of Celestial / Night really.

Bugs:

Nothing significant beyond the previous report. The Orbit status effect uses the default no-picture picture (the question mark with the curve around it), but that's it.

Have used all of Shooting Stars, the first three of Deep Space, all of Night, and the first of Sigils. Plus a bunch of base game talents, of course.


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:32 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
smithfield wrote:
The particle effects from Shadow Blast remain after casting and effect is complete.

Can't replicate.

Updated:
The Midnight Talent Tweaks setting no longer locks Star Fury for Anorithil. Too many other good categories to unlock.
Warped Space now works.
Reduced the Energy generation from Wax and Wane, as apparently I'm the only person who likes interesting resource mechanics.
Rebalanced Disciple of Dusk.
Corrected Orbit Status Effect icon.
Tried to fix the Midnight and Gates of Morning shops, but I'm not sure what is going on here.

Edit:
Drat, forgot to change the XP penalties.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:14 pm 
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Higher

Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:19 am
Posts: 77
Celestial Intervention still does nothing. I would send a log but there isn't anything to send, you just die. No shield, nothing.

Also.

The Cosmic Quiver effect at talent level 5 where the shots become beams. If the Starslinger equips a shield, they lose this. Is that intentional?


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 11:31 pm 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
I don't see how Celestial Intervention could not be working, but I guess I'll go over it again.

As for Cosmic Quiver; That would be really annoying to code, so its not deliberate and I have no idea how/why its happening.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 22, 2020 11:49 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
Didn't get around to updating this addon this weekend.
But nevermind, I expect I'll be forced to work from home by next week.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2020 5:52 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
I did some testing and Celestial Intervention is working for me.

Can't replicate the Cosmic Quiver+Shield issue either.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2020 7:25 pm 
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Higher

Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:19 am
Posts: 77
I feared as much. I've had it 'fail' about 3 times. Which convinced me to report it, but something made me wonder. May I ask how you tested it?


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2020 12:39 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
You may...




Anyway, I used the lua console to slap my life down in varying amounts and from varying points. No issues.

I also went and stood still in the Slazish Fens a couple of times to see if the Nagas using Poison and Water Bolt would be able to kill me through it. They couldn't.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2020 9:44 pm 
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Higher

Joined: Wed May 23, 2012 1:19 am
Posts: 77
I hope that didn't come across as impertinent. I think it might be obvious but I'm doing some little thing wrong and I don't even know where to start looking for it. Even though I've made an addon, I've avoided getting into dev mode cause I've got a slow machine. I really appreciate all your time and art. It pains me to have made a false bug report. I was just thinking that I might learn something about the practical art of testing and I did.

Thanks again.


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2020 11:59 pm 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
You've either broken something with your mod-mod, or another mod is breaking the interactions.

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2020 2:20 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
Updated:

Wane now says that its "dark" damage scales with your Spellpower, not "light" damage...
The Gates of Morning should now sell Sceptres.
Removed some spawn code for a NPC I never got around to making.
Removed XP penalties from Mardrop and Star Elf.
Sun Paladin no longer gets the Glyphs category.
The change escort rewards setting is now hidden. The change celestial talents setting is back. >_>

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2020 9:42 pm 
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Thalore

Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:41 pm
Posts: 136
Played a Mardrop Moon Paladin in the newest version.

The Sunwall Orchard has a very nice map layout.

  • Mana Flare lasting for 10 turns and not 5 is an unusual departure from racial abilities. I would rather see it give a stronger buff for a shorter time.
  • Blessing of Altia has unusual numbers. Max resistance is much stronger than resistance itself, but it gives the same amount to both. Similarly, x% increased penetration is rather stronger than x% increased damage. Even if it's intended to be taking you from 70% to 80% resists, it's probably better in a standard curve scaling rather than 2% per point.
  • Hale is deeply underpowered. Quick Recovery and Fast Metabolism, two of the game's worst class talents, give 4x the regen of Hale. Further, I don't think giving a race interactions with a specific resource (unlike Higher's Bloom which is every resource) is a good idea. If you're not a Mana/Stamina/Psi user, it's useless. If you are a mana user, it's still useless because it's a tiny amount compared to Shadow Combat/Natural Regen/Manasurge. Psi users and Stamina users have even better recovery options. And if you made it strong enough to matter, it would risk making their resource costs (even more) trivial.
  • Since Mardrops have a theme of summer/light elements in their second talent, maybe Chromatic Flash could be limited to those 6 elements? That would give them a nice synergy there. Fun talent.

  • Cloak in Night gives Stealth and invisibility? I'd probably make it just the invisibility. And its numbers are quite small.
  • Nocturnal Raid uses Wild Speed and thus breaks if you do anything other than moving, but doesn't tell you this.
  • Disciple of Dusk's negative-gain-on-kill is incredibly small.
  • Wax and Wane being identical talents except for their costs is really not fun.
  • Moongate's description could be more clear about which end gets the light and which gets the darkness. It's a very nice talent, though.
  • Moongate's says it moves you to the target tile but actually moves you somewhere within 2 of the target tile.
  • Constellation Strike's description could be more clear about where the user ends up and what happens to the primary target.
  • Sigil of Sleep says 'a magical sleep' but it's actually a normal sleep, just applied with spellpower. The description also doesn't list the sleep's power.
  • Moontide has an unusually high cost and cooldown for its mediocre effect.

  • Class starts with daggers and light armor, but not the talent for either.
  • No real reason not to go for Heavy Armor, although unlike the base Celestials, you actually can run out of Positive.
  • Night doesn't compare to Light at all in usefulness. Probably intentional.
  • Wax and Wane being identical talents except for their costs and types is really not fun.
  • Although a hybrid rogue/mage, has no source of bonus spellpower to make up for the fact that they're not using a staff.
  • Nothing really brings together the weapon attack and dark spell parts of the class.
  • Trees are fairly crowded with activatable talents - in fact the new trees have no passives at all.


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 2:46 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
Hmm a very large pile of useful feedback. Thankyou.

5 is not the usual duration of the first racial ability anymore, as there is now a few different durations around. I could condense the Mana Flare and Shadow Swell effects into shorter durations, but I'm not sure its worth the effort.

The Blessing talents are primarily for the Max Resistance and Resistance Penetration. The Resistance and Damage bonuses are just there as filler, because I didn't want to go too high on main values. I didn't use a standard scaling curve as they tend to cause issues with small numbers. Like no effects on some point investments.

Hale: I'm either misreading the numbers, or "4x" is an exaggeration.

Chromatic Flash: The racial theme is closer to general magic use than anything specific. So its supposed to be completely random.


Everything in the Night Category: This was designed to be a Negative Energy generator originally. It needs redoing now that you get free Celestial Energy. Night was supposed to mirror Light in functionality, but not in power.

Wax and Wane: The Radius 4 nuke was quite fun until I decided that was a bit OP. These were supposed to be your bread and butter attacks that also kept your Energy generation going. Without the Energy generation need, they look a bit out of place.

Moongate: Somehow I hadn't noticed this. It should be perfect targeting. I gave up on the description. It was getting complicated.

Constellation Strike: Yep, that is bad. Nothing special should be happening to the primary target though.

Sigil of Sleep: Will likely disappear anyway. I may as well just give them the new Glyphs category.

Moontide: That is a bit high. Its a Mirror of a talent called Prominence. Would you prefer cheaper or stronger effects?


Moon Paladin starting talents: I was trying to stick to the general rule of only have 4 starting talents. But that is increasingly being ignored, and you don't really need Restful Night to start your Energy generation anymore. So I'll likely change it when I review the class.

Heavy Armour: I'm not going to enforce equipment choices on you, unless its actually part of the class.

Lack of Spellpower bonus: I guess. But you generally get more from the Magic stat than you do from a Staff. I'm not aware of Sun Paladin or Reaver getting anything.

"Nothing really brings together the weapon attack and dark spell parts of the class." Wane and Constellation Strike?

The Guidance category has three sustains. Or did you mean unlockable categories?

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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 8:59 pm 
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Thalore

Joined: Mon Jul 30, 2018 8:41 pm
Posts: 136
Makes sense that a lot of this is because of the Energy regeneration change. :)

Hale Life: 1.0-5.0
Fast Metabolism Life: 3.4 - 8.9
Hale Stamina: 0.2-1.0
Quick Recovery Stamina: 0.8-3.1
So it starts at 3.4x and 4x, gets to 1.9x and 3x.
A little bit of an exaggeration, but still substantial.

Moontide: Cheaper would be better, in my opinion.

Spellpower: Reaver gets Bloodlust, which gives up to 66 spellpower. You're right about Sun Paladins, but they do get Spellcloak with its impressive cast speed and spell cooldown bonuses.


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 Post subject: Re: Midnight (v1.13)
PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2020 12:00 am 
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Perspiring Physicist

Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 7:43 am
Posts: 6152
Recaiden wrote:
Hale Life: 1.0-5.0
Fast Metabolism Life: 3.4 - 8.9
Hale Stamina: 0.2-1.0
Quick Recovery Stamina: 0.8-3.1
So it starts at 3.4x and 4x, gets to 1.9x and 3x.
A little bit of an exaggeration, but still substantial.

You are also comparing one talent with two.
But yes, I sort of aimed a bit low, as I wasn't sure what a balanced value would be, or whether it could be ridiculous on a stamina and mana using class.
I sort of needed a way to make all resources regen a bit faster, but there isn't an easy way to do that.

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