ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:28 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 9:17 pm
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Really excited for the class rewrites! Rogue feels so much more interesting and fun to play. The little cosmetic effect on shadowblade is nice but it's still kinda sad to see the class basically staying unviable, but that's such a minor gripe compared to everything here. Only bug i've noticed so far is disengage seems to think targeting is always locked to an enemy?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:21 pm 
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Thalore

Joined: Tue Jul 22, 2014 10:20 pm
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Possessor is a free win on Madness...

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:22 pm 
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Spiderkin

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:05 pm
Posts: 492
Mex wrote:
Possessor is a free win on Madness...

Working as intended. There's no way to balance enemies vs enemies when you get to madness scaling lmao. Even on insane 1 unique kill early game is about 10k hp + whatever EHP you get

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<Shibari> You're full of shit
<darkgod #tome> ster is a troll
<Sheila> and ster, i do agree with you on most things game-related, but do try to not be such an ass!
<mex> your posts lead to people like me being abused and murdered


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:33 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 703
As somebody who plays on Madness, I'd quite like to see at least some effort at balance. I understand it's not as important as lower difficulties where more people play, but I love the class concept and I would be very disappointed to see it turn into a class I can't play because it would make wins meaningless.

Edit: Mex, I haven't playtested much, since the Solipsism/psi change will change balance massively. What makes the class so imbalanced? Could it be solved by a cap on talent levels or life, which wouldn't affect lower difficulties but would nerf possessing a 50k HP boss significantly?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:45 pm 
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Spiderkin

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:05 pm
Posts: 492
presumably its the part where you have madness stats (especially hp and TL), plus your weapons/sustains (50% allres and some evasion is good), plus extras (1 unique in vor armory is worth like 500k HP on madness). however madness balance is not really a priority but maybe some rescaling could happen after like, 25k maxhp/TL10 on enemies lol (you'll only see this on the tail end of insane and never on normal)

tbh the easy solution is to make uniques count as bosses (how the hell did anyone miss this??) for that body snatcher talent (+forcing u to cat point possession to make it useful)

also mex was crying to me on the discord about ways of getting EHP that don't involve hp, with disruption shield being the main one mentioned but idk what to really do about that

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<Shibari> You're full of shit
<darkgod #tome> ster is a troll
<Sheila> and ster, i do agree with you on most things game-related, but do try to not be such an ass!
<mex> your posts lead to people like me being abused and murdered


Last edited by ster on Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:54 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 703
Well, one approach would be to ban specific, clearly imbalanced talents. Disruption Shield and Summon come to mind, but others could be added as they pop up.

As I said, capping talent level and life would solve that particular problem.

Resall needs to be capped if it isn't already.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:56 pm 
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Higher

Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2016 8:07 pm
Posts: 72
How exactly does the life matching on ominous form work? If you don't deal any damage to the target will their health get reduced by it or does it only work the other way around? And is it another exception to the no healing rule, so if your target heals itself will your %life go up?
edit: wouldn't be too difficult to test in dev mode, but since it's the last talent of a locked level 10 category it seems like it would be useful to have the description clarified for people not interested in/familiar with that


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 10:58 pm 
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Spiderkin

Joined: Tue Dec 13, 2016 7:05 pm
Posts: 492
Parcae2 wrote:
Well, one approach would be to ban specific, clearly imbalanced talents. Disruption Shield and Summon come to mind, but others could be added as they pop up.

As I said, capping talent level and life would solve that particular problem.

Resall needs to be capped if it isn't already.

Then the problem is that you are trying to balance a class that gets every talent in the game at increased power. You know, like adventurer.

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<Shibari> You're full of shit
<darkgod #tome> ster is a troll
<Sheila> and ster, i do agree with you on most things game-related, but do try to not be such an ass!
<mex> your posts lead to people like me being abused and murdered


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:00 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 703
What's the link for the Discord chat?


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 31, 2017 11:58 pm 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Thu Jan 23, 2003 8:13 pm
Posts: 1724
Location: A shallow water area south of Bree
delvin_anaris wrote:
  • The Disengage talent appears to expect enemy-targeting for both which enemy you're trying to get away from and where you want to land. This means you have to use the mouse to target the landing, and is very confusing at first, especially for someone who used the old Disengage and expected it to just bounce you away from the targeted enemy once you selected them.

Hmm, that actually sounds a lot like issues I've noticed with Gunslingers' Strafe talent. [sound F/X: source diving] Meh, code looks superficially similar between the two talents, in that both call :getTarget() twice in a row; possibly said calls are tripping over each other?

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 12:33 am 
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Master of Eyal

Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2002 9:26 pm
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Beta2 is up! Changes from beta1 : http://paste.net-core.org/raw/jihetesavu
Downloads always at : http://te4.org/beta-test

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:07 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
Heh. Kinda' sounds like marksmen took a bit of a hammer, but went back to never running out of stamina ever. Need to see about giving that a try soon as it finishes the dl, ehehe.


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:37 am 
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Low Yeek

Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2016 11:04 pm
Posts: 7
Zizzo wrote:
delvin_anaris wrote:
  • The Disengage talent appears to expect enemy-targeting for both which enemy you're trying to get away from and where you want to land. This means you have to use the mouse to target the landing, and is very confusing at first, especially for someone who used the old Disengage and expected it to just bounce you away from the targeted enemy once you selected them.

Hmm, that actually sounds a lot like issues I've noticed with Gunslingers' Strafe talent. [sound F/X: source diving] Meh, code looks superficially similar between the two talents, in that both call :getTarget() twice in a row; possibly said calls are tripping over each other?


Strafe, however, does not ask for a destination for its second argument, but rather a direction. Thus, there is no problem with using it entirely with the keyboard.

When I activated Disengage, it was asking for the enemy to disengage from, then leaving them highlighted when asking for where to go, and when I tried to navigate with the keyboard, it would only switch back to me or to other nearby enemies.

However, it looks like DarkGod has addressed this in the new beta, so woo!


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 1:42 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Sat May 15, 2010 9:17 pm
Posts: 1457
Huh. Anyone know if it's intentional that projectiles hit with shot down damage their originator if the projectile happens to be superimposed with them? Just knocked down an arrow that hadn't left its starting square, yet, and it caused it to hit the archer that shot it. Which is neat, but I'm not sure if it's working as intended, heh.

E: Also, have to say, pleasantly amused with how hard a skeleton archer spikes in the beginning of the game, heh. 4/5 master marksman by level 5 (and could have been maxed) is neat. Don't think the addon testing stuff happened with the bumped up stat racial...


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 01, 2017 2:26 am 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 703
The talent from Mind Steal is not affected by the new cap on stolen talents.
Edit: Ominous Form seems craaaaaaaaazy powerful. Needs more testing but it seems to be basically invulnerability for X turns as long as you don't attack the target.
Edit2: For some reason the starting two-handed weapon appears in the transmog chest.
Edit3: OK, Ominous Form can be resisted. That could be documented a bit better. Still managed to clone the Eidolon.
Edit4: Ominous Form is indeed broken. If you're not attacking the target, it's 14 turns of being all but invulnerable. Making it 5 turns, 50 cooldown, and melee range only would help.


Last edited by Parcae2 on Wed Feb 01, 2017 2:49 am, edited 4 times in total.

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