ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

Recent additions: my Corruptor and Doomed guides, Mankeli's Paradox Mage guide, and dadito's Mindslayer guide.

Potential tier list changes:
Sawbutcher A -> B
Mindslayer B -> A
Doomed B -> A
Corruptor B -> C
Gunslinger C -> B
Cursed D -> C
If you have lots of experience with one of these classes on Insane/Madness and think they should be moved a tier, let me know.

Agreed on Mindslayer A, haven't played the other classes enough to have an opinion. Demonologist should probably get tiered somewhere (B most likely, i could make a case for A tier but the class does have some pretty large weaknesses holding it back)

Cursed is in a weird place where its stronger than Alchemist/Rogue/Bulwark/Archer but weaker than Tier C classes so its like a Tier 3.5 class.

http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=41&t=45949

I think this thread is a good resource as it list the tinkers, their requirements and what they do with their skills

Btw i suggest to add the link to your wiki pace in the signatures so everyone can look at it without searching necessarily this 3d

posetcay wrote:Cursed is in a weird place where its stronger than Alchemist/Rogue/Bulwark/Archer but weaker than Tier C classes so its like a Tier 3.5 class.

cursed isn't really that much stronger than bulwark

Yeah cursed is pretty bottom tier on insane imo.

Is tier C gunslinger not counting the usage of Awesome Toss + Movement Infusion? Or does that "trick" loss potency in Insane+?

Mordy wrote:Is tier C gunslinger not counting the usage of Awesome Toss + Movement Infusion? Or does that "trick" loss potency in Insane+?

It's not because that would be like ranking sawbutcher for old saw wheels

I consider the Awesome Toss thing to be an unintended exploit similar to Augmentation snapshotting so I assume people won't use it. I wouldn't consider a win using that to be a legitimate win. I agree about Cursed being in the awkward spot where it's clearly worse than all the tier C classes but clearly better than all the tier D classes. I'm going to leave it in D for now.

unrelated but why is the godawful bulwark guide still in that list? it's full of such crazy suboptimal advice that it's actively harmful to link to it IMO
e: maxes con, maxed spell shield/the stam on kill thing from combat vet, doesn't get dex, 1/5 GWF and riposte, no charm mastery, EGSS, batshit dungeon order

plus his insane victory had 8 deaths so he must have played terribly

Yeah I'm seriously considering removing it since it has a bunch of bad advice. GWF is easily the best talent Bulwark has other than maybe Step Up. I'm thinking that the writer won in spite of the build rather than because of it.

bpat wrote:I consider the Awesome Toss thing to be an unintended exploit similar to Augmentation snapshotting so I assume people won't use it.

Fair enough!

They should probably change awesome toss so it acts either once per turn, or inherits your attack speed, instead of attacking every time you act.

My prediction for 2017: Marksman will be tier B

Rogue will probably be A if it's anything like the addon i downloaded (for like 5 minutes before not bothering to actually play one)


e: iirc there were some pretty big changes to Mobility/Survival in there too