"Odyssey of The Summoner" is OUT!! Find it here...

[nekarcos]

@Arsonius
RE: Mist breaking "Stare Down"
Ah... So this is definitely an issue bugging quite a few people-- Including myself. This will probably be something I post in the update after this coming one, because this current update is already QUITE loaded...

RE: Cold Blood bonus effect
You're definitely right-- I have constantly questioned the usefulness of EXP/Level bonuses, since ToME enemies scale UP to YOUR level. However, I'm still interested in the idea of the player being rewarded in a PERMANENT way for VERY meticulous gameplay. A thought is a diminishingly-increasing "power" bonus (what kind of power it is, I don't currently know) based on how many Merciless Kills you have, and how "good" your ratio is. However, I don't exactly want to "inhibit" the player, or "rigidify" their playstyle by making them feel "pressured" into keeping up a good kill ratio JUST so that their "damage" stays relevant. I like the "casualness" of the current effect-- Honestly, the way it currently is feels perfect to me, but the nature of ToME's automatic level scaling nullifies ALL of its useful... Darn. Back to the drawing board.

As for "Headhunter"... I feel it's something most people can ignore, to be honest. I don't currently have a very good idea of how much "money" this talent should offer because I don't know exactly how many Uniques/Bosses a "winning" Ritch kills on average. I will probably be balancing and tweaking the talent based on THAT.
That said though, I have a VERY special purpose in mind for it (as you can probably imagine if you've tried it out yourself), so I don't mind it being useless for the time being.

RE: Cold Blood should give Wild Power...?
Hrrrrmmm... The truth is, I didn't feel anybody would EVER spend points in "Dragon Scales" unless they were also offered freebie Wild Power-- They would almost ALWAYS spend it on Natural Combat instead (since the bonuses are SIGNIFICANTLY better and the benefits are MUCH more apparent).
Giving the same treatment to "Cold Blood" wouldn't really be fixing its current inherent problems-- Only really just dulling the "blehness" of them... A solution much similar to pouring ketchup onto a great big clover of onion:
CHOMP! BLEH!! TASTY! *COUGH HACK*

So yeah-- I plan to draw appeal to this talent tree through the sheer MONEY GAINS it would provide and... AH SCREW IT!! I'll just tell you EXACTLY what I'm planning:

In the future, the "Trophies" you retrieve from certain "special" enemies will grant special bonuses just by carrying them. For example, Trophy of Bill The Troll would give you "Life Regen +3, -10 Magic". In addition to this, each trophy will have some lore associated with it. Bill's might sound something like this: "This repulsive head of a deceased troll STILL seems to be trying to recoup, but cannot find the rest of its master. Boy... Trolls sure are tenacious."

The "plan" and "idea"... Was to give Ritch the ability to "acquire" meager accessories via headhunting-- Hence why it has no set of special slots much like Hydra and Fire Drake do. It was going to "replace" Hoarding Beast in its functionality-- But then I realized how BAD it would be to remove such a staple mechanic from Ritch-- So here we are right now...


RE: Separate Consume
That MIGHT work, but I'd prefer not to "split up" the talent in that mannerism (coding and overhead reasons)
You're on the right track, though...

RE: Sickening Mist auto-firing
WHOOPS!! This was remnant code from when it used to be an indefinitely-sustained talent. I'm sure you can understand why it's not anymore, right? Heh...

RE: Pyro Wheel unclarity
Reworded.

RE: Fire Drake inspiration
Now takes higher duration.

RE: Inspiration... Vanishes?!
... You got me there. My only guess is that I've somehow foolishly allowed it to roll a duration LOWER than 1... *... inspects the code...*

Code: Select all

self:setEffect(self.EFF_DRAKE_INSPIRED, 100*math.pow(rng.float(0, 1), 2), {})

... Duration is... Random number between 0 and 1... To the power of 2... Multiplied by 100... Yuuuuup... Definitely seems like I did EXACTLY that. THAT'S definitely fixed now.

... But that also means you've actually managed to get unlucky enough to roll so low on a (rather rigged) 100-sided dice...



Alright, I think that's about everything you asked. Cheers, and thanks for your input! I always appreciate the feedback-- And the bug reports! Nice... You hit 5 problems-- The rest will require observation though.

[Arsonius]

You're right about wild power not fixing the issue with talent, I just couldn't think of anything better. Collecting different heads as accessories definitely sounds like a neat concept (witcheritch?).
Also, on the topic of Ritch, maybe remove cooldown of Killing blade? It already takes a lot of time and you can't craft them in battle anyway.

And got another error with Ritch: http://imgur.com/a/Jc8Ov

[nekarcos]

@Arsonius
It's so that you can't craft them on-the-run in the situation that you are being hunted!

Also-- Some things I noted from looking at your character...
... This is an OLD version character! So old, it doesn't even have the new Natural Combat talents yet! Hmmm...

-- But, more importantly-- You somehow got "Technique/Combat Training"... Which I'm CERTAIN I made unavailable to Avatars... How'd you do that...? Did I miss something??

And finally-- Man. EVERYONE is doing the "THW Armor" thing now, huh? I WOULD nerf that (and yes, I WAS planning to at one point BEFORE it became "meta"), but then I'm afraid "jenx" might never forgive me and stop playtesting entirely, hehehehe...

[Arsonius]

I've edited a previous post, but you may have missed it, so here is some bug: http://imgur.com/a/Jc8Ov

Well, it isn't that old, I think only 2 or 3 updates back. About Combat Training - I simply bought it in Last Hope like I usually do?
In fact I just tried to do that with my current Ritch and it worked just fine:
http://te4.org/characters/56415/tome/5b ... 8f3ee2c71f

About THW - I think I also had consumed every psionic/anti-magic artifact/purple that I found. I'm afraid there is simply nothing else to raise except Armor and either Phys Power or Mind Power, and nature/psionic/anti-magic simply aren't that common as master items. And I haven't found any Unknown-powered items on that playthrough except for Tooth of the Mouth.
Bonuses from THW certainly could be more interesting though. But I can't think of anything interesting at the moment...

Also, why not just increase the duration of crafting for the same 20 turns cooldown takes now? As of now it is just another button (rest) to press for each one while you craft them.

[nekarcos]

@Arsonius
RE: Bug image
Yup, I've seen that bug and dealt with it.

RE: Learned Combat Training?!
... Add-on shenanigans...
The shop owner usually tells you that you lack the "attributes" to learn it. Oh well...

RE: Treasure Hoarder's Will
I'll keep watching this talent.
Rather than take power away from it ("nerf" it), I will probably just introduce some weaknesses to it. I'll be keeping those a secret, though!

RE: Killing Blade cooldown...?
If you're caught during crafting (and thus, forced to stop), it will remain on cooldown-- That's why it has one.

[Arsonius]

Not sure what addon may have caused this, since I only have 2 and both are utility. I actually have 2 lines of text with trainers - one teaches like usual, second says that you can't hold a weapon. So I thought it just meant that you wouldn't be able to wield weapons and not unavailability of category. Well, I just won't use it then.

About cooldown: yes, but it stays at 19 until the end of crafting so you have to wait anyway. Could it reset cooldown upon successful crafting? I usually craft them in batches and 30 clicks instead of 20 is noticeable. If it isn't easy to do, than nevermind. I guess I spent more time typing this than I spent crafting swords...

[daed4]

Well, it isn't that old, I think only 2 or 3 updates back. About Combat Training - I simply bought it in Last Hope like I usually do?

Doesn't work in the current update.

[jenx]

@Arsonius
It's so that you can't craft them on-the-run in the situation that you are being hunted!

Also-- Some things I noted from looking at your character...
... This is an OLD version character! So old, it doesn't even have the new Natural Combat talents yet! Hmmm...

-- But, more importantly-- You somehow got "Technique/Combat Training"... Which I'm CERTAIN I made unavailable to Avatars... How'd you do that...? Did I miss something??

And finally-- Man. EVERYONE is doing the "THW Armor" thing now, huh? I WOULD nerf that (and yes, I WAS planning to at one point BEFORE it became "meta"), but then I'm afraid "jenx" might never forgive me and stop playtesting entirely, hehehehe...

exactly. leave armor alone

[nekarcos]

"Odyssey of The Summoner" has been updated!! (Version 0.4.2)

*** Version: 0.4.2 ~ "Now with more AI... And ANGER!!"

*** Sorry about the wait! Taking advantage of the extra time, this update features A LOT of things I've always wanted to look into, so enjoy-- And as usual: Tell me what you think!
*** This update is primarily focused on doing A LOT of tune-ups I have been waiting a long time to do. Particularly, "Drakelings" have been nice and oiled-- No longer do they behave all creakily or dimwittedly-- Nope. It's nothing but intentional stuff now!
*** And finally... Grrr... "That bug" has gotten the better of me-- But I WILL find it... And I WILL kill it...

[STORY]
*** I took difficulty away from the silly parts (leaving the battlefield) and put them into the SENSIBLE parts (DURING the battlefield). THIS should make things a little more interesting...!
(CHANGES)
- "The Summoner" is now a tad... Taller! (I REALLY hope this doesn't cause "further" problems concerning "that bug"...)
- The enemy army's EXP worth is SIGNIFICANTLY higher; It is possible to reach level 2 before even leaving this zone!

(BUFFS)
- The enemy army in the introduction battle is SIGNIFICANTLY stronger (5 times, in fact!). Don't just sit there-- Help them out!!
- The Summoner is no longer holding back in the introduction battle. Beware his wrath...
- You will now gain a short burst of speed (+1000% Movement Speed) upon entering the Wilderness for the first time. Use it wisely!

(NERFS)
- During the introduction sequence, you are no longer credited for kills you didn't execute.
- The Summoner is no longer as talkative when approached from the south in heated combat.
- "That One Minotaur" in the introduction battle is no longer as unstoppable. Maybe you should help it...
- Turtles are less durable!
- The Fire Drakes and Hydras guarding The Summoner are significantly weaker


[GENERAL]
(BUFFS)
- "Monstrosities" will get a Scrying Orb, as long as they're NOT an Avatar!
- As such, use of the "Wilder" class as Monstrosities has been re-enabled!
*** This is ENTIRELY for exploration purposes! I have no intention of producing *complete* compatibility just yet...

(CHANGES)
- Aesthetically renamed "Strength of the Bear" to "Savage Strength". It honestly didn't roll off the tongue very well!
- "Examine" and "Inspect" menu options will now only show up on objects if you're currently playing an Avatar campaign.
- After looking through some code, I found "Resource Leeching", which has FINALLY given me a frame of reference for resource-scaling. If you receive "100 Resource", here are the new factors each resource will undergo:
> Mana now has a 100% factor (from 33%)
> Equilbrium now has a 35% factor (from 16%)
> Vim now has a 50% factor (from 16%)
> Positive now has a 25% factor (from 8%)
> Negative now has a 25% factor (from 8%)
> Hate is now INCLUDED (40% factor)
> Psi now has a 20% factor (from 33%)
- ... On that note, BEWARE "Corrupted" Avatars... There is now new behavior for you when you are MANABURNED...

(NERFS)
- Avatar starting inventory items SHOULD no longer be unique/egoed.

(BUGS)
- There is an exploit where one could invest 10 points into a Natural Combat talent, use the talent, then take back the points-- Allowing one to "selectively" gain "Disciplined" benefits for free. As such (and to mitigate any further misunderstandings with "Disciplines"), Natural Combat talents are now set in stone and cannot be unlearned.
*** Because of the disruption this bug has caused (and how "heavy-handed" this change might be), all Natural Combat talent points will be refunded when you enter the Wilderness, allowing you to "reconsider" your choices one more time. Apologies!
*** If any issues are caused by this, let me know, and I'll see if I can come up with a better compromise than this. This mechanic is VERY fresh and unexplored, so I can only imagine what kind of troubles it will cause in the future...
- Fixed a severe bug with NPC "Orders". Admittedly, it was a VERY hasty implementation, and I REALLY should have examined this better...

(???)
- *...slips 1 Gold into everyone's pocket...*


[HYDRA]
(BUFFS)
- Increased the "braindead" threshold of "Incite Death"
- Slightly lowered the cooldown of "Incite Death"
- "Delta Formation" no longer takes time to use.

(BUGS)
- Removed the "cooldown" parameter from "Hydra Breath". I hope this doesn't cause any funny business!
- "Sickening Mist" no longer automatically uses itself when switching levels... WHOOPS!!


[FIRE DRAKE]
(BUFFS)
- "Wingbeat" now scales with Dexterity (NOT Strength!)
- "Wingbeat" now also dazes those affected.
- "Glide" now cools down "Mighty Wings" talents by TWICE as much.
- "Low Flight" no longer negates your Stun Immunity (but becoming stunned will still double the duration)
- "Role Model" no longer requires YOU to be inspired (I don't even remember why it worked like this...)
- "Torrential Blaze" has slightly modified (unnoticeable) properties, such that Drakelings can properly make use of it in combat.
- "Inspiration" now always takes the higher duration (won't be replaced by a shorter one)

(NERFS)
- "Low Flight" cooldown has been raised to 20 (from 14) to reflect the "Glide" buff.
- Fixed a bug that caused "Backdraft" to cause an ABSURD amount of damage...

(CHANGES)
- Various "Savaging Claws" talents now clarify that they are "weapon" attacks, capable of triggering on-hit effects and the like.
- Some reordering of triggers in "Role Model"
- "Role Model" description text now indicates how many more talents each of your drakelings can inherit
- "Backdraft" now indicates whether an actor has smashed into something or not.

(BUGS)
- Clarified "Pyro Wheel" text to say "Any" instead of "Enemies"
- Fixed an issue with Inspiration sometimes rolling a duration lower than 1, causing it to never exist. Now it always rounds up, ensuring you will, AT LEAST, have 1 turn (if you're that unlucky).

(???)
- A surprise awaits the Fire Drake that plays in "The Arena"...


[DRAKELINGS]
*** WHEW!! Now that I finally found some time to look into things, I have IMPROVED the Drakeling's AI SIGNIFICANTLY!! Let's look at what's been modified:
(BUFFS)
- I have put Drakelings through Nekarcos School of "White Maging". Their healing AI has been SIGNIFICANTLY improved, now making them fairly reliable (though still pitiful) healers.
- Updated and slightly tweaked the healing prioritization. Drakelings now consider YOU (the player) to be SIGNIFICANTLY more important when deciding on who to heal.
- Increased the frequency of talent usage-- But also intensified the effect Cunning has on it. Overall, Drakelings use talents more frequently now!
- Increased starting life by 100; reduced life-per-level by 2. In summary, Drakelings have more life "sooner" now. YES, I know. It's silly that your child could have more maximum life than YOU do, but I'm putting my foot down on how to improve early Drakeling survivability. *stomps foot*
*** BEWARE: The potency of a drakeling's "anti-death" effect is based on the difference between its Maximum Life and the PARENT'S Maximum Life! This has effectively reduced the "die-at" threshold for drakelings under "anti-death"!

(CHANGES)
- I believe I have FINALLY fixed Drakeling pathfinding! Rather than explaining it, you should just try it out yourself!
- Drakelings will no longer attempt to use "Glide" in order to get close (this was remnant code). Also, they will now only use this to fly back to you when endangered.


[RITCH]
(CHANGES)
- "Concealed Blade" is now a no-energy, toggleable sustained talent, allowing you to opt-in to the auto-swap effect.

(BUGS)
- Fixed an error regarding "Merciless Killing"... Again...?? Huuuh...


~~~ VOLATILE ~~~
[Hydra]
> Recuperate is still on-going

[Fire Drake]
> Fire absorption is still on-going

[Ritch]
> Free Cold Blood is still on-going
> Locked trees is still on-going





... WHEW!!!
... Now... If you all don't mind... I'm going to get some sleep...

[astralInferno]

So yeah-- I plan to draw appeal to this talent tree through the sheer MONEY GAINS it would provide and... AH SCREW IT!! I'll just tell you EXACTLY what I'm planning:

In the future, the "Trophies" you retrieve from certain "special" enemies will grant special bonuses just by carrying them. For example, Trophy of Bill The Troll would give you "Life Regen +3, -10 Magic". In addition to this, each trophy will have some lore associated with it. Bill's might sound something like this: "This repulsive head of a deceased troll STILL seems to be trying to recoup, but cannot find the rest of its master. Boy... Trolls sure are tenacious."

The "plan" and "idea"... Was to give Ritch the ability to "acquire" meager accessories via headhunting-- Hence why it has no set of special slots much like Hydra and Fire Drake do. It was going to "replace" Hoarding Beast in its functionality-- But then I realized how BAD it would be to remove such a staple mechanic from Ritch-- So here we are right now...

That sounds amazingly cool. I'd rush and max that talent in a heartbeat.

[nsrr]

Not sure what addon may have caused this, since I only have 2 and both are utility. I actually have 2 lines of text with trainers - one teaches like usual, second says that you can't hold a weapon. So I thought it just meant that you wouldn't be able to wield weapons and not unavailability of category. Well, I just won't use it then.

I suspect it is ZOmnibus. I noticed this at one point, too, but then stopped using ZOmnibus with OoTS and promptly forgot about it

At first I thought it was just standard Last Hope merchant behavior, although the other chat options seemed a little odd. Then I noticed with another character that the standard option was not there. After comparing the two, I noted that ZOmnibus was the only difference. A quick dive into the character vault confirms that ZOmnibus is one of the two add ons this character was running, as well.

ZOmnibus is a QoL pack, but it touches on so many things that I couldn't begin to point you in the direction of the conflict. I think it has something that lets you make a note of items stores are carrying that you want to buy -- maybe in there somewhere? I'm just guessing, though.


Re: Armor
One of the things I have never liked about ToME is how good the Armor stat is. I have seen highly experienced players say over and over again that literally everyone should wear Massive Armor. Archmage? Massive. Corrupter? Massive. Doomed? Massive.
Unless you are a Brawler (I think it's an Unarmed Combat limitation? Haven't messed with them much, tbh) or a Stealth Rogue (I've also heard it argued many times that Armor trumps Stealth and you are better off only floating a point or two in it during the early game), wear Massive. I wish that there were compelling reasons for 'Casters' to wear Cloth and 'Rogues' to wear Light (and for anyone besides Brawlers to wear Heavy), but sadly there just is not. Fatigue means less than nothing and the requirements for equipping armor and putting points into Armor Training can be easily met by stacking gear with +STR.
Armor reduces damage before any other calculations, as far as I know (including things like resistance and crit bonuses). Quick example: if a mob with 50% crit mod hits you for 100 and you have 20 armor (you also have to have at least 20% hardiness, but everyone does), a crit would only do 120 ((100-20)x1.5), rather than 130 (100x1.5 - 20). (I am far from an expert on this, though, and the whole armor/hardiness thing still gets me mixed up, so if I mucked that up and someone knows better, please correct me.)
On top of that is the unfair scaling on Weapon Training physical power I mentioned before, making Weapon damage much more dangerous in the late game than either Spell or Mind damage. This is one of those things that is more noticeable on higher difficulties, but is still absolutely a thing, even on Normal.

In short, it is a failing in ToME and not OoTS, but OoTS operates within the confines of ToME, so... If you can come up with an elegant compromise that doesn't leave Avatars terribly susceptible to the deadliest sources of damage, I, for one, will be really glad to see it. I am not exaggerating when I say that this whole thing bothers me every single time I sit down to play ToME. You have a lot of freedom in how you play ToME, but in this there is no flexibility (at least, if you want to survive).

Maybe in the context of THW it would encourage more variety in what you swallow if the Armor bonus was based on the total encumbrance of all (non-white) items in your stomach, and Master Crafted could grant a different bonus (maybe physical power?). I dunno, just throwing ideas out there. Like I said, it's a complicated problem.

[noppa354]

I made the mistake of leaving this addon activated when not using it, and it seems to have leaked a bit. That is to say, the summoner's retreat has appeared.
Also, this error appears repeatedly in the sandworm lair after returning from the east:

Code: Select all

Lua Error: ...neka_therianthropy_summoner/superload/mod/class/Grid.lua:8: attempt to call global 'base_tooltip' (a nil value)
	At [C]:-1 base_tooltip
	At ...neka_therianthropy_summoner/superload/mod/class/Grid.lua:8 check
	At /engine/Map.lua:801 checkEntity
	At /mod/class/Tooltip.lua:36 check
	At /mod/class/Tooltip.lua:71 getTooltipAtMap
	At /engine/Tooltip.lua:284 displayAtMap
	At /engine/interface/GameTargeting.lua:66 targetDisplayTooltip
	At /mod/class/Game.lua:1597 

[daed4]

Unless you are a Brawler (I think it's an Unarmed Combat limitation? Haven't messed with them much, tbh) or a Stealth Rogue.

Wearing massive blocks both unarmed combat techniques and stealth. Which means you should totally do an adventurer stealth fister.

[nekarcos]

@nsrr
RE: ZOmnibus pack
... I'm not even going to ATTEMPT to figure out what that add-on might be doing. However, I DO despise the fact that it makes "Combat Training" available to Avatars... That's not cool-- "Thick Skin" is WAY too powerful for avatars (since they not only ALREADY get a "Thick Skin" substitute through gameplay, but they each already have some way to scale in power out of Constitution.)

RE: Armor is broken
If the consensus is "Armor is just plain broken"... Then I guess I have no place trying to balance/tweak anything about it. However, it still GREATLY concerns me how "readily available" 100+ Armor is to Hoarding Beast users (you shouldn't be seeing numbers like that until LATE game)-- Especially considering how accessible Nature Hardened already is. It honestly feels like there only needs to be ONE great thing-- Two is a bit overkill.

... But, oh well. Balance is not my biggest concerns at the moment, to be honest-- Especially not "overpowered" balance. I'll allow that to remain as a thing, as long as it finally gives me the freedom to work on some OTHER things I consider far more important than making numbers go up and down (as you have probably seen in this update).


@noppa354
RE: Sandworm Lair
Mmmm... That problem is somewhat out of my hands. In summary, it is something DarkGod did that I can't really code around, so the simplest solution is for me to "silence" the tooltip code for the time being. In truth, all my superload even did was add little messages that ENTIRELY state the obvious: "Oh, yes-- This pool of water is wet-- And yes... That very foggy, obscured area is misty."

... Probably not necessary to have this for now.


RE: The Summoner's location... Revealed!
... Now... Even though I have already begun arranging support for harmless, cameo visits to The Summoner in non-Avatar campaigns, I had NO intentions for that to happen... Yet.

I think I've fixed it now though... Nice catch!

[Tinyshockwave]

I made it to the Far East with a "Clever" Hydra! and the run promptly ended in Vor armory... I am learning however! Progress!!

The master was the hardest part, I beat him by the skin of my teeth, and use almost my entire stock of infustions to do so. Even still, I died twice to him, mostly because I got trapped by his tank minions. This fight comes at a low point for this build, when the breaths are falling off, but it hasn't gotten the points yet to start being crafty. I do, however, have some ideas for this problem next time, namely going more into mists so i have an escape.

I died in Vor armory, but not to the boss. No, once I got the boss alone my cc shut him down completely, he didn't even deal 300 damage to me after that, but it did take about 50 turns to kill him... low damage. The mages teleported around and got so separated I couldn't really fight or avoid them, so when I finaly had to confront them I just got bombarded from all directions to death. Bleg, they are always difficult, this is nothing new. I'll have to figure something out.

My general strategy this run was to stack cc on my main priority, because I don't deal the damage to fight a fair fight. I got enough tank to survive the rest of the rabble.(except dang skeleton warriors) Once the cc is there I can leisurely kill them with just breaths, thought the Master's teleports would kinda interrupt this. You could say this strategy makes me the "Underdog," eheheh. I got hallucinations going a bit, and those a great, especially for making aoe mages kill their friends, but I still needed more points in the first ability to make the size really useful.

I found another bug with glares, too. I was gazing with four heads, and one got beheaded, but I kept gazing with four heads... lol.

ALSO, Gwai's Burninator was the BEST thing to happen to this run, I want to marry that lady.

My next post will be either of victory, or some bug too great to continue, but I don't expect that to happen (fingers crossed) I do not give up easy.