In-Universe Religion

[Red]

Does it exist? We've seen a radical, extremist nature cult, a small, radical, extremist nihlism/universal rebirth cult, and we've seen plenty of demonic cults.

But what about, say, the gem shop owner in Derth? The citizens of Last Hope? Do they worship in Elvava? I mean, we know for a fact gods have existed. You can follow a God-Slayer who's following a god, you can talk to a woman who ate a god, and you can stop people from summoning a (the?) god (God?). But that's either ancient history, unkown to the normal person, or for the most part, both.

So do they still remember the gods? have they made their own new ones to worship? I mean, when I set foot in Trollmire as a Cornac Berserker, did I go here to please Khorne? Am I apostate, seeking blood and glory? Or did I leave because I scoffed at piety-minded fools who had no strength to wield a blade?

To me, it would seem they'd have to have some kind of religion. Perhaps not in Last Hope, but in Derth? Where they've lain, small and vulnerable, to trolls and undead and rogue mages and Zigur inquisitions and god knows what else, in addition to just plain struggling to get by because they're mediveal peasants, basically, just minus the lord. It's not a young town, so I'd imagine these people have found something to put faith in.

[breadsmith]

The gods are all long dead. Why spend the effort to worship something that could not even save itself? In many fantasy settings, the gods are known variables, to the extent that the gods may have daily contact with their worshipers. In these settings religions make sense, as there is proof of the god's existence. In ToME, people seem to know that the gods were things that came and went. There is almost no point to worshiping them because they are all dead. And what is the point of making up a god to worship, when there are real (albeit dead) ones around?

[Red]

Because there's nothing else to believe in.

Their religion doesn't have to be mono- or even polytheistic. It could be spiritual, natural, whatever, but it's kinda hard to believe they're all... Well, not atheists, since they (might) know gods existed, but faithless.

As for them knowing the gods are all dead, how? How on earth would they know? Linaniil knows. We know, because we read the lore. The Sher'tul know. But honestly, the gods have been dead for millenia, and they were killed off by a race that is itself gone. I wouldn't even be certain your average scholar would know the gods have died, let alone your average townsperson.

Really, I'd just like to see the current world fleshed out a little bit more. Eyal has a lot of history, but as for how it is today... That info's lacking a bit.

[HousePet]

They don't need gods. They know that the unexplained stuff happens because of magic.

[Red]

*Looks at Summoners causing dragons to appear out of mid-air and dissappear less than a minute later.*

Magic. Of course.

I don't suppose there are any remnants of gods left over from older versions of ToME that might make sense as something people would look to, not knowing that it's been dead a long time? (Or is still in the process of running for its life?)

[0player]

Not many know all about Godslayers, I assume. I would think that Gerlyk at the very least is still widely worshipped by humans, it'd be logical that he is.
Those who say that religions in ToME settings don't make sense: are you assuming that religions are about stuff that is real? Religions fulfill a human need to feel important/protected/guided, they don't have to have a real object.

[darkgod]

99.999% of the population has no idea gods ever existed, nor do they have a concept for it. Most of them think sher'tuls area myth, if they even haerd about it, which most dont.

I do not see why they would need faith either. So mostly nope, they do not believe in any gods, nor haev a concept of gods.
If you want to see worship, go look at demons, they do believe in their very real god, deeply.

[Doctornull]

99.999% of the population has no idea gods ever existed, nor do they have a concept for it. Most of them think sher'tuls area myth, if they even haerd about it, which most dont.

I do not see why they would need faith either. So mostly nope, they do not believe in any gods, nor haev a concept of gods.
If you want to see worship, go look at demons, they do believe in their very real god, deeply.

On my planet, we don't actually know if gods were real or not either, but there are more than a few humans who have chosen to believe in one or more gods none-the-less.

So yeah, I don't really see factual reality as necessarily relevant to human belief.

[Red]

Gerlyk you say? Who's Gerlyk?

[astreoth]

I am disappointed that a talk about in game religions has forgotten the entire meta class based on celestial worship

so the religions in eyal that I can list are

the children of urh'rok and various demon cults

the sorcerers and their cult working toward gerlyks return

the wilders and their nature worship, I think zigur is just the extremist side of this

the celestial's who praise the sun and sometimes moons and other space rocks (yes moons eyal has two)

and thats just what I'm 100% sure of

cause the grand defiler may be worshiping blight he's definitely teaching its use and thinks a lot of it

and I think theirs an underwater god that survived the godslayers that might have a cult of nagas or something

so worship in eyal doesn't have to be based on an actual god it can be also be based on getting fantastical powers

faith does seem entirely absent though

[Red]

Good point. The East is pretty religious, at least on the non-Orcish side, and I'd be pretty willing to believe the Orcs wouldn't have religion even if the gods were alive and kicking simply because they'd find that demeaning to worship something that isn't an Orc itself.

But I'm more asking about the average person. We're fighting to save the world (or for blood and loot, with the whole world saving thing as a side effect) but we barely know anything about the majority of people in the world. I assume that the people we see in towns is just a small sampling of the actual inhabitants, so even with the few existing communities it's still the majority of people. And all we know is that occassionally they're rare and we murder them.

Gerlyk is the God god? Not just a god? Yeah, I can see him being worshipped.
Nature too would make sense, and I can see magic itself being worshipped by minor talents and those without any.
Demon worshippers tend to either die or not live in communities, so I doubt there are many, if any, in towns.

Alright, looking at Derth, I think Stire the Alchemist is a magic "worshipper". He believes in the power of magic and scoffs at those who rely on nature or anything other than the raw power of magic inherent in potions and the world. He's probably not well liked. The Herbalist is a devotee of nature and is at serious odds with Stire, but not the extent of any kind of violence. The rest of the shopkeeps, asides from the Gem shop, are all weapon or armor makers/sellers. They'd most likely be following Gerlyk or nature, assuming there aren't any surviving stories of gods of combat, war, blacksmithing, anything related to their professions. The various gardeners would be most likely nature, again assuming no surviving stories of fertility, life, or other such planty gods.

Since with the exception of Stire, everyone would be for Gerlyk or nature, I could easily see the two blending together. Gerlyk would, regardless of whatever the hell it started as, become known as the god of nature, giving life and growth to all the world, whereas the nature worshippers might have tendencies to include a godlike Mother Nature in their worshipping, instead of simply nature itself. The most likely change for Derth itself would be a small shrine in part of the town, an overgrown area with a statue in the middle and a plinth or something for offerings. It could be something for people to flock to when the Gwelgeroths arrive, though it wouldn't offer any protection considering Gerlyk is dead and nature doesn't help anyone, you just kinda have to force it to work for you.

[astreoth]

huh just remembered that dragon worship is also a thing wyrmics canonically do

also gerlyk isn't dead he survived the god slayers by escaping into the void, at the final boss battle you fight the sorcerers to prevent his return.

also he's pretty much been entirely forgotten by the vast majority of civilization like the rest of the gods.

as for him being the God god or primary god I think that typically goes to the strongest of the pantheon which would be the sher'tul god amakathel, though its possible gerlyk was the first to create a race (humans) and all the others ripped off his design.

[Red]

Then it's probably nature worship, and no one much likes Stire.

So they're trying to bring back the coward god/god of foresight/the one the Sher'Tul forogt about until it was too late? Considering they seem smart enough I trust their judgement it'd end the world and the fact Gerlyk lasted long enough to escape when the strongest of them was slain, they're bringing back a relatively weak god.

You know, Garkul seemed overpowered to me, but the Sher'Tul just blow him away. Wonder if any learned sages worship them.

[darkgod]

Doctornull, and why should fanstasy races in a fantasy world follow the same pattern as some humans here on earth ?

As for Gerlyk, he is just a god; Amakthel was the first one to create a race.
Though even Amakthel is "just a god"; do not mistake Eyal gods with the earthling concept of one God. Gods in Eyal universe are local phenomenoms to their planets; kind of like the essence of the planet, or the first evolved life forms or whatever.
And they are different for each planet; so Eyal had multiple gods while Mal'Rok had (and still does) only one.

[Red]

Because they still have human minds. They'd respond in similar ways to similar stimuli. Halflings are more military, Dwarves greedier, but all basically human.

And they've been shown to worship excessively powerful local phenomenon, such as dragons. So why not worship even more powerful things?

Interesting. So [Father] is not an outside being but the voice of Mal'Rok itself. And if gods are the essence of a planet, Eyal is one hell of a strong planet all considering.