Necromancer strategy/builds

[Zonk]

Yeah I know, a bit soon to talk about it but some people other than me must have unlocked it. I'm finding the early levels(ok, level - haven't gotten to 2 yet, but then I unlocked it like, 1 hour ago or so?) VERY hard because my minions have a tendency to end up outside my aura(radius 2 isn't much)and turn to ash.

On the other hand, some of the higher level talents look pretty interesting, especially the Advanced Minions tree - I expect to spend a lot of points there eventually.

Any thoughts?

[edge2054]

I invested in the minions talent early and was real careful with them until after Prox. Basically I only summoned minions if my aura count was maxed or I was using them for a tough fight. They die really easy because of the small aura size.

After Prox I put everything into the aura radius increasing talent that I could. Then I murdered Bill and it was pretty much smooth sailing ever since then.

Some synergies I found important for my particular playstyle I'll list below.(note I went heavy summoning but used shades instead of advanced minions because Curse of the Meek seemed more important to me then anything in the advanced summoning tree, I would have eventually picked up the other tree but the character got lost in the SVN shuffle).

Max Create Minions and Aura Mastery first.

The rest of this do as you see fit.

Curse of the Meek to replenish necrotic aura; you'll also pick up shadow tunnel learning this talent which is a nice spell to have. (max or if there's a break point at level 4 leave it at 4; leave shadow tunnel at level 1.)

Will O Wisp to get more out of each necrotic aura point. (maxed)

Surge of Undeath because it's amazing. (I'd put points in here whenever I felt my minions damage was falling behind. Probably had it at 4 when I quit.)

4 points in Invoke Darkness so I could use Rigor Morits (great for buffing and protecting your minions; one point is enough early on), Circle of Death (really just need one point here for the banes; also helps keep minions alive), and Fear the Night(good spell but I only had one point in it) without killing my minions.

Aside from that I'd recommend picking up one point in Impending Doom and maxing out Blurred Mortality. This will probably put you at around level 25 or 30.

For generics I used Arcane Eye, phase door, teleport, etc. Nothing special here really, it's all mage generics.

One pit fall I want to mention is Dark Empathy. A point here early is fine but you won't have enough resists or saves to pass on to your minions until the east (most likely) so maxing this talent early really doesn't give you much. Later on though I imagine it's a must have talent and one I was planning to put points in.

[edge2054]

Managed to pull the character dump from my old save. Note I beat the ambush with this character though minion scaling was a bit bugged at the time (still I think I would have had a chance).

Code: Select all

  [Tome 4.00 @ www.te4.org Character Dump]

Sex              : Male         STR:  16
Race             : Dwarf        DEX:  8
Class            : Necromancer  MAG:  67
Level            : 29           WIL:  47
Exp              : 68%          CUN:  11
Gold             : 1821.95      CON:  48

Accuracy(Main Hand):  18        Life             :     617/617  Encumbrance      : 54/68
Damage  (Main Hand):  91                                        Difficulty       : Normal
Permadeath       : Roguelike
APR     (Main Hand):  15        Mana             :     444/444
Crit    (Main Hand):   5%       
Speed   (Main Hand): 1.00       
                                
                                

Fatigue          : 12%          Spellpower       : 82
Armor            : 14           Spell Crit       : 27.9%
Armor Hardiness  : 30%          Spell Speed      : 1
Defense          : 8.1          
Ranged Defense   : 8.1          
Physical damage  : 16%
Blight damage    : 4%

Physical Save    : 85.803111620181
Spell Save       : 104.30311162018
Mental Save      : 66.526430909091

All Resists:  15%
Cold Resist(cap):  42%( 70%)
Acid Resist(cap):  21%( 70%)
Nature Resist(cap):  29%( 70%)
Blight Resist(cap):  20%( 70%)
Confusion Resistance:  11%

Number of NPC killed: 2904
Most killed NPC: will o' the wisp (303)

  [Talents Chart]

 - Race / Dwarf                       (mastery 1.00)
    Resilience of the Dwarves (generic) 1/5
    Stoneskin (generic)               1/5
    Power is Money (generic)          5/5
    Stone Walking (generic)           1/5
 - Technique / Combat training        (mastery 1.00)
    Thick Skin (generic)              5/5
    Armour Training (generic)         1/10
    Combat Accuracy (generic)         0/10
    Weapons Mastery (generic)         0/10
    Knife Mastery (generic)           0/10
 - Cunning / Survival                 (mastery 0.90)
    Trap Detection (generic)          0/5
    Heightened Senses (generic)       0/5
    Trap Disarm (generic)             0/5
    Evasion (generic)                 0/5
 - Spell / Conveyance                 (mastery 1.20)
    Phase Door (generic)              5/5
    Teleport (generic)                1/5
    Displacement Shield (generic)     1/5
    Probability Travel (generic)      2/5
 - Spell / Divination                 (mastery 1.20)
    Arcane Eye (generic)              1/5
    Keen Senses (generic)             1/5
    Vision (generic)                  1/5
    Premonition (generic)             0/5
 - Spell / Necrotic minions           (mastery 1.30)
    Create Minions (class)            5/5
    Aura Mastery (class)              5/5
    Surge of Undeath (class)          4/5
    Dark Empathy (class)              1/5
 - Spell / Nightfall                  (mastery 1.30)
    Invoke Darkness (class)           4/5
    Circle of Death (class)           1/5
    Fear the Night (class)            1/5
    Rigor Mortis (class)              4/5
 - Spell / Shades                     (mastery 1.30)
    Shadow Tunnel (class)             1/5
    Curse of the Meek (class)         4/5
    Forgery of Haze (class)           0/5
    Frostdusk (class)                 0/5
 - Spell / Necrosis                   (mastery 1.30)
    Blurred Mortality (class)         5/5
    Impending Doom (class)            0/5
    Undeath Link (class)              0/5
    Lichform (class)                  0/5
 - Spell / Grave                      (mastery 1.30)
    Chill of the Tomb (class)         1/5
    Will o' the Wisp (class)          5/5
    Cold Flames (class)               0/5
    Vampiric Gift (class)             0/5

  [Inscriptions (4/4)]

Infusion: Wild
Infusion: Regeneration
Rune: Manasurge
Rune: Shielding

  [Current Effects]

- Will o' the Wisp
- Blurred Mortality
- Necrotic Aura
- Chant of Fortitude

  [Character Equipment]

 In main hand
a) Bolbum's Big Knocker (64-76.8 power, 10 apr, physical damage)
   Type: weapon / staff
It must be held with both hands.

Base power: 64.0 - 76.8
Uses stat: 140% Mag
Damage type: Physical
Accuracy: +7
Armor Penetration: +10
Attack speed: 100%
When wielded/worn:
Changes damage: +16% physical
Talent mastery: +0.20 Spell / Staff combat 
Spellpower: +12
Spell crit. chance: +18%

   Dropped by skeleton mage
 In off hand
 On fingers
b) Vargh Redemption
   Type: jewelry / ring

When wielded/worn:
Changes stats: +4 Wil / +6 Con
Changes resistances: +10% nature / +25% cold
Maximum mana: +20.00
Maximum stamina: +20.00
Maximum air capacity: +50.00
It can be used to summon a tidal wave, costing 60 power out of 60/60.
   Dropped by Zuberiwe the thalore
c) savior's copper ring of focus
   Type: jewelry / ring

When wielded/worn:
Changes resistances penetration: +5% physical
Physical save: +6
Spell save: +5
Mental save: +6
It can be used to activate talent Greater Weapon Focus (costing 80 power out of 80/80) :
Effective talent level: 4.0
Use mode: Activated
Range: melee/personal
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: instant
Description: Concentrate on your blows, each strike has 11% chance to deal another similar blow for 9 turns.
This works for all blows, even ones from other talents and shield bashes.
The chance increases with your Dexterity.

 Around neck
d) serendipitous steel amulet of seduction
   Type: jewelry / amulet

When wielded/worn:
Changes stats: +12 Lck / +2 Wil
Stamina when hit: +1.00
Maximum stamina: +10.00

 Light source
e) Summertide Phial
   Type: lite / lite

When wielded/worn:
Light radius: +4
It can be used to call light, costing 10 power out of 15/15.
   Dropped by Prox the Mighty
 Main armor
f) troll-hide hardened leather armour of the deep (3 def, 8 armor)
   Type: armor / light

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +8
Defense: +3
Fatigue: +8%
Changes resistances: +7% cold / +7% acid
Allows you to breathe in: water 
Life regen: +3.20

   Dropped by Xanona the thalore
 Cloak
g) linen cloak of the Shaloren (1 def, 0 armor)
   Type: armor / cloak

When wielded/worn:
Defense: +1
Changes stats: +2 Wil / +1 Mag

 On head
h) champion's rough leather cap of greater telepathy (0 def, 1 armor)
   Type: armor / head

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +1
Fatigue: +1%
Changes stats: +1 Str / +2 Wil
Grants telepathy: All 
Confusion immunity: +11%
Life regen: -3.00
Light radius: +1

   Dropped by The Shade
 Around waist
i) spiritwalker's rough leather belt of unlife
   Type: armor / belt

When wielded/worn:
Changes stats: +1 Str / +1 Mag
Changes resistances: +6% blight
Allows you to breathe in: water 
Mana each turn: +0.16
Maximum mana: +20.00

 On hands
j) spellstreaming hardened leather gloves of protection (0 def, 2 armor)
   Type: armor / hands

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +2
Changes stats: +2 Wil
Changes resistances: +6% nature
Physical save: +3
Spell save: +5
Mental save: +5
Spellpower: +3
Spell crit. chance: +3%

 On feet
k) eldritch pair of hardened leather boots of spellbinding (0 def, 3 armor)
   Type: armor / feet

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +3
Fatigue: +3%
Changes stats: +2 Mag
Mana each turn: +0.11
Maximum mana: +23.00
Spell crit. chance: +2%
It can be used to activate talent Metaflow (costing 80 power out of 80/80) :
Effective talent level: 2.0
Use mode: Activated
Range: melee/personal
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: 1 turn
Description: Your mastery of the arcane flows allow you to reset the cooldown of 4 of your spells of tier 2 or less.

 Tool
l) Tooth of the Mouth (dig speed 12 turns)
   Type: tool / digger

When wielded/worn:
Armor penetration: +5
Damage when hit: 15 blight
Changes damage: +4% blight
It can be used to dig a wall, cut a tree, ..., costing 1 power out of 1/1.
   Dropped by The Mouth
 Quiver

  [Player Achievements]

'Against all odds' was achieved for Killed Ukruk in the ambush. At 2011-08-20 01:52:18
'Curse Lifter' was achieved for Killed Ben Cruthdar the Cursed. At 2011-08-17 01:53:20
'Exterminator' was achieved for Killed 1000 creatures At 2011-08-18 17:10:03
'Home sweet home' was achieved for Dispatched the Weirdling Beast and taken possession of Yiilkgur, the Sher'Tul Fortress for your own usage. At 2011-08-18 18:20:16
'Level 10' was achieved for Got a character to level 10. At 2011-08-17 02:29:34
'Level 20' was achieved for Got a character to level 20. At 2011-08-18 19:42:39
'Rescuer of the lost' was achieved for Rescued the merchant from the assassin lord. At 2011-08-17 20:36:25
'Savior of the damsels in distress' was achieved for Saved Melinda from her terrible fate in the Crypt of Kryl-Feijan. At 2011-08-19 15:39:04
'Squadmate' was achieved for Escaped from Reknor alive with your squadmate Norgan. At 2011-08-17 01:50:36
'That was close' was achieved for Kill your target while having only 1 life left. At 2011-08-19 23:28:54
'The Arena' was achieved for Unlocked Arena mode. At 2011-08-17 01:56:31
'The secret city' was achieved for Discovered the truth about mages. At 2011-08-17 11:49:35
'Treasure Hunter' was achieved for Amass 1000 gold pieces. At 2011-08-19 14:36:02
'Vampire crusher' was achieved for Destroyed the Master in its lair of the Dreadfell. At 2011-08-20 01:33:31

  [Character Inventory]

a) movement infusion (562% speed; 6 turns)
   Type: scroll / infusion

When inscribed on your body:
Effective talent level: 0.0
Use mode: Activated

Range: melee/personal
Cooldown: 18
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: instant
Description: Activate the infusion to increase movement speed by 562% for 1 game turn.
Any actions other than movement will cancel the effect.
Also prevent stuns, dazes and pinning effects for 6 turns.
Note: since you will be moving very fast, game turns will pass very slowly.

It can be used to inscribe your skin with the infusion..
   Dropped by elder vampire
b) invisibility rune (power 8 for 6 turns; 6 charges)
   Type: scroll / rune

When inscribed on your body:
Effective talent level: 0.0
Use mode: Activated

Range: melee/personal
Cooldown: 20
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: 1 turn
Description: Activate the rune to become invisible (power 8) for 6 turns.
Charges remaining: 6

It can be used to inscribe your skin with the rune..
c) invisibility rune (power 9 for 6 turns; 5 charges)
   Type: scroll / rune

When inscribed on your body:
Effective talent level: 0.0
Use mode: Activated

Range: melee/personal
Cooldown: 16
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: 1 turn
Description: Activate the rune to become invisible (power 9) for 6 turns.
Charges remaining: 5

It can be used to inscribe your skin with the rune..
d) speed rune (speed 40% for 5 turns; 8 charges)
   Type: scroll / rune

When inscribed on your body:
Effective talent level: 0.0
Use mode: Activated

Range: melee/personal
Cooldown: 18
Travel Speed: instantaneous
Usage Speed: instant
Description: Activate the rune to increase your global speed by 40% for 5 turns.
Charges remaining: 8

It can be used to inscribe your skin with the rune..
   Dropped by skeleton warrior
e) protective stralite amulet of the chosen
   Type: jewelry / amulet

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +3
Defense: +6
Damage on hit(melee): 6 light
Damage when hit: 5 light
Changes resistances: +5% light
Stun/Freeze immunity: +18%

   Dropped by The Master
f) Orb of Scrying
   [Plot Item]
Type: jewelry / orb

When carried:
It can be used to use the orb, costing 1 power out of 1/1.
g) gladiator's gold ring
   Type: jewelry / ring

When wielded/worn:
Physical power: +5
Changes stats: +5 Str / +6 Con

h) wizard's stralite ring of see invisible
   Type: jewelry / ring

When wielded/worn:
Changes stats: +6 Mag
Spell save: +6
See invisible: +17

i) Bokelagar
   Type: weapon / greatmaul
It must be held with both hands.


   Dropped by Ukruk the Fierce
j) Staff of Absorption
   [Plot Item]
Type: weapon / staff
It must be held with both hands.

Base power: 30.0 - 33.0
Uses stat: 100% Mag
Damage type: Arcane
Accuracy: +20
Armor Penetration: +4
When wielded/worn:
Spellpower: +20
Spell crit. chance: +10%
It can be used to absorb energies, costing 1000 power out of 1000/1000.
   Dropped by The Master
k) ancient cashmere robe of power (2 def, 0 armor)
   Type: armor / cloth

When wielded/worn:
Defense: +2
Changes stats: +4 Mag
Damage on hit(melee): 8 temporal
Changes damage: +7% physical / +11% arcane / +11% fire / +11% cold / +11% lightning / +11% acid / +10% nature / +11% blight
Confusion immunity: +13%
Spellpower: +4

   Dropped by Betayanne the human
l) Steel Helm of Garkul (0 def, 6 armor)
   Type: armor / head

When wielded/worn:
Armor: +6
Fatigue: +8%
Changes stats: +5 Str / +4 Wil / +5 Con
Physical save: +12
Spell save: +12
Mental save: +12

   Dropped by Minotaur of the Labyrinth
m) 60 alchemist agate
   Type: alchemist-gem / black

When used as an alchemist bomb:
Bomb damage +5%

   Dropped by Vorivea the bloated horror
n) lapis lazuli
   Type: gem / blue

When wielded/worn:
Defense: +6
When used to imbue an object:
Defense: +6

   Dropped by ghoul
o) turquoise
   Type: gem / green

When wielded/worn:
See invisible: +10
When used to imbue an object:
See invisible: +10

   Dropped by armoured skeleton warrior
p) hummerhorn wing
   [Plot Item]
Type: misc / ingredient


q) ritch stinger
   [Plot Item]
Type: misc / ingredient


r) vampire lord fang
   [Plot Item]
Type: misc / ingredient


s) garnet
   Type: gem / red

When wielded/worn:
Changes damage: +6% all
When used to imbue an object:
Changes damage: +6% all

   Dropped by ghoul
t) Transmogrification Chest
   [Plot Item]
Type: chest / sher'tul

It can be used to open a portal to send items to the Fortress core, extracting energies from it for the Fortress and sending back useless gold., costing 0 power out of 1000/1000.
u) Rod of Recall (0/1)
   [Plot Item]
Type: wand / wand

It can be used to recall the user to the worldmap, costing 400 power out of 173/400.
v) amber
   Type: gem / yellow

When wielded/worn:
Changes damage: +8% all
When used to imbue an object:
Changes damage: +8% all

   Dropped by master vampire

  [Last Messages]

[Dwarf_Hammer]

I had an easy time with my necromancers. I played 3, so far. 1st necro died to insidious poison. 2nd was stopped by a bug. 3rd is doing great. Tips: Max out 'invoke darkness', for self-sufficient killing, and 'create minions' asap. I only used my minions for boss battles, until I max out the aura.

I also tested a few endgame necromancers in debug mode. Here are my results:

- Vampiric Gift is bugged. It has no mana cost, so you basically get free healing.
- Blurred mortality is basically an extra 250 HP, which is nice.
- You will have a lot of spare generic points left.
- The advanced minions tree isn't that great. All I ever got from it were dredges.

@edge2054

You need to max-out invoke darkness now for your minions to be immune.

[edge2054]

No you don't dwarf hammer. Putting four points in it puts the effective talent level at 5.2 (enough for minion immunity).

[Zonk]

Got to level 12 and things are going much more smoothly.

I definetely agree on the 'lots of spare generics' thing - I've been trying to solve this by raising Con for Thick Skin and improving Displacement Shield, which although I don't use it often, could be decent vs bosses, I guess.

[greycat]

Yeah, the thing that surprised me the most about this class was the complete lack of any class-specific Generic trees. Everything's class talent points, except Conveyance and Divination.

[edge2054]

Some kinda rituals tree would fit well. Though what these rituals would do I don't know >.>

[bricks]

Hmm.... As far as mechanics go, Rituals could be activated skills that only take effect after a timed effect counts down.

[edge2054]

Yeah, I was thinking some sorta multi-turn cast that gave you a bonus of some kind. Didn't want to hijack the thread to badly. I do have some ideas though. I'll make a new thread for it.

[shooth]

Whats the word on the minion master skill? Even if the other skills in that tree arent worth it, might still be worth getting if you get a reasonable rate of return on the more powerful summons....
thoughts?

[Dwarf_Hammer]

I tested a minion-less, endgame necromancer. They're very powerful. Probably more powerful than the minion-based version. Vampiric Gift is great. I wonder if you can combine it with other forms of HP leeching to get constant healing... Oh, and Haze of Forgery is awesome. My clone defeated a dozen high-level orcs by itself.

Anyway, my current necromancer finally has a place to dump all his generic points thanks to the SWQ. I'm kinda surprised that a necromancer can use equilibrium talents. I don't think a person who regularly breaks the laws of nature would be communing with it.

Whats the word on the minion master skill? Even if the other skills in that tree arent worth it, might still be worth getting if you get a reasonable rate of return on the more powerful summons....
thoughts?

I created over 40 minions and only got a few dreads and a wight.

[greycat]

I don't think a person who regularly breaks the laws of nature would be communing with it.

Think of it as learning nature's secrets so they can be twisted to suit your own goals.

[bricks]

I have a Necro through the starting zones and Old Forest; just opened up the fortress. It's been fun, though the management of the minions is a little tedious. I think Probability Travel is going to be very nice for dropping a bunch of minions into a room. Unsurprisingly the best use of minions is a bunch of skeleton archers in a large, open space. Necro damage suffers with this build, since I haven't built into Grave. Killing my own minions isn't very appealing. A minionless build (or a build that only summoned minions for the sake of Wisps/meat shields) is definitely appealing. Fear the Night is pretty good damage, and the knockback is considerable, but it's still not been enough to keep be going without a wall of minions.

The hardest fight so far has been the Weirdling Beast. Unsurprising. My damage output was just slightly too low to keep the WB down, and Corrupted Negation absolutely wrecked my minions. If I had made better use of my skills I think I could have beat him the first time (had to run away and build up souls). I'm still getting used to these icons.

[martinuzz]

My current necromancer is a minion build, and it seems to be working pretty well so far.
Advice for minion builds: play a ghoul. Retch, retch and retch.
A nice synergy there is Healing Nexus from the harmony tree.
Recth works so well, that most minion losses are not due to them getting killed by NPC, but by dumb pathing causing minions to fall too far behind.

Ghoulkings are cool. I just had one inflict a 28-turn rotting disease on a NPC. I haven't seen them summon stuff yet though.
Runed Bone Giants are nice.
Minion mastery at 5/5 has made me pretty content as well, giving me liches, dreads, and wights.
Liches are amazing. Want a mage/doomed/negative anorithil undead summon? You got it!

I just beat the crap out of 4 acolytes in some dark crypt. They took 2 turns each to die. Strategy: 3 mages, 2 master archers and a Runed bone giant. Blastblastblastblastblast, nowhere to run.
Basically, I didn't do anything but walk towards the altar and whistle a merry necromancer tune.

However, getting Melinda out of the dungeon proved too difficult. Did I mention friendly fire?
(please, could Melinda get the escort's option to 'wait a few turns'?)

I'm level 24 now, time to clear the last few optional dungeons in the west, and then I'll try my minions' luck at beating the ambush.

A few notes:
- Contrary to it's spell description, summoned cute bunnies killed by you will yield souls, resulting in infinite necrotic energy. You can configure your minion party as you want it. Just make those summon types you don't want explode, retch a bit, kill some bunnies (retch will do this for you as well as healing damage from minion explosions) and cast new minions. Repeat until you have 6 liches, or until your patience runs out.
- Minions have a "detect teleport" ability. If a monster targeted by a minion phases, or teleports away, the minion will know exactly where it went and head in that direction.
- Minion pathing, when they're not targeting anything, is sub-optimal, if not faulty. They get stuck in dead-end, forking corridors all the time.
- Minions can spawn with runes. If you notice one of your minions has a nice rune, like invis, take extra good care of it.
- Minions can spawn with artefacts (extremely rare). They drop on death. Dunno if this goes for all minion types. I've had a armoured skeleton warrior drop the Sword of Potential Futures.