For a long while i mainly played cornac's. The extra talent point was just too useful.
But with the new race tree each race except cornac got: Which race has the best race tree in your opinion? This time of the year i play mainly on my notebook without internet when i have to do long waiting times in a truck. So i have a shalore berzerker on the notebook and a yet to start character on the computer with internet.
Designing the Shalore Berzerker
So my first try was to start a shalore character. To understand the race tree and get as much of it as i could i decided that i would give 19 generic points to the race tree and also a talent point if this is possible.
The first race power gives speed depending on dexterity. So for the first 19 levels i kept dexterity at maximum and the remaining points into strength. Precise strikes and Berzerking are at 5 each already. So both sustains add to hit chance depending on dexterity. I hope that i can save on weapon combat points this way to save some generic points.
The second race power is a passive one. As i learned: passive combat arts win nothing from boosting the tree when wearing mastery items or using a talent point. But it will add 5*2% critical chance and a berzerker can take good use of critical chance.
The third race power: chance to get invisible when hit for more than 15% of your health. Invisibility power however depends on magic, outch. Currently only level 19 i never got invisible, but i wasn't really hit hard too yet.
The fourth power: It can be activated to reduce the duration of negative stuff while it lengthens the good stuff: 12 more rounds to unstoppable, evasion, speed, bloodbath, resolve, ... ?
Is it really this way ?
So for me beta24 will be testing race trees. I will add a character dumb if i will reach level 35 and played a bit with the 4th power.
Anyone else is testing race trees and what are your experiences: are they useful enough to give up 19 generic points and 1-2 talent points (1 because you are not a cornac then, 2 if you also add 0.2 to race tree to have talent power 6 instead 5 if maxed).
Race decision: which race trees are useful?
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Re: Race decision: which race trees are useful?
Dwarves look *really* good with probability travel, and lots of high save gains up to +50 in all (Power of money!).
Automated extra armor looks good OK, but not permanent. 5 points looks a bit much, but not bad if you're lvl 50 and need spots to spend those last generic points.
Automated extra armor looks good OK, but not permanent. 5 points looks a bit much, but not bad if you're lvl 50 and need spots to spend those last generic points.
Re: Race decision: which race trees are useful?
I also played a Shalore Zerker a bit.
Timeless is really nice but it's 5 more turns to your good stuff and 10 off the bad or at least that's how I read it. Also 5 more turns of bloodbath or resolve isn't anything special, both of these buffs over write (like stun) and you'll lose the 5 bonus turns as soon as it goes off again. However... 5 more turns of wild infusion, regen infusion, or perfect strikes is really nice, especially considering you can pop both infusions and perfect strikes on one turn and timeless on the next and clear your infusion saturation
Timeless is really nice but it's 5 more turns to your good stuff and 10 off the bad or at least that's how I read it. Also 5 more turns of bloodbath or resolve isn't anything special, both of these buffs over write (like stun) and you'll lose the 5 bonus turns as soon as it goes off again. However... 5 more turns of wild infusion, regen infusion, or perfect strikes is really nice, especially considering you can pop both infusions and perfect strikes on one turn and timeless on the next and clear your infusion saturation
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Re: Race decision: which race trees are useful?
Higher
Gift of the Pureborn
A solid regeneration if you are already focusing on willpower, otherwise, points invested might not be that good of an idea. It isn’t strong enough to replace a regeneration rune, but, if for example, you were going to play a Wilder of some kind, then a Higher is definitely a good choice because of this talent.
Overseer of Nations
This is a unique talent and a very good one at that. It is pretty simple to, for every point invested; you gain 1 more tile of vision. No, this is not infravision or a light radius; it is just that much further for you to see. Now, in some cases this isn’t worth all that much because you won’t have a light radius greater than eight or so, but a lot of dungeons are fully and perm lit, such as the Old Forest and the Orc Prides – so it gives you a drop on npcs from a distance that they won’t be capable of seeing you from. Think of it as a passive, non magic detection spell in such cases.
Born into Magic
This is maybe a bit too niche to be too useful as Arcane damage is relatively rare for the player to be faced with, and there are many sources of increased spell save. For now, I’d leave it either alone completely or only invest a single point. But, as more spells/things do Arcane damage, the better this will get.
Highborn’s Bloom
This is just absolutely insanely good. This is one of two ways that you can recover Stamina without waiting and it effects ALL your resources, so if you nabbed something that requires mana and you have stamina and vim or some other concoction, this recovers some for all of them. This is the ultimate second breathe talent and as far as I’m concerned, if you find yourself over exhausted with resources, consider taking this talent. It is amazing.
Shalore
Grace of the Eternals
Dexterity based Global speed increase. If going dexterity already, then this is amazing. If not, and you can spare say 30 points for dex and you’ll be using equipment to raise it, then this is a good one to invest in. It’s not quite as god awful good as it was in comparison to the other options now available to players, but it is still really really good.
Magic of the Eternals
If you want to blast things to bits with crits, then here is your new favorite talent. All ways you can crit are increased in chance with this talent, and while it might scale a little low, if you are attacking in multiple ways [say physically and with spells] then this is probably worth it.
Secretes of the Eternals
While this invisibility effect does run off of Magic [making it almost specialized for Shadowblades], it is decent enough as is. The greater the amount of hp you have though, the less dangerous it is to ‘try’ and trigger this. It’s more of a slightly helpful triggered escape talent than anything else, but if you are investing in magic, you probably will like this one a lot, especially if you are a Reaver or Corrupter.
Timeless
This works as advertised: Beneficial timed effects are elongated and baneful timed effects are shortened. The more points invested, the shorter the cooldown and the bigger the difference in durations. This is a great talent for late game when you are always getting diseased, poisoned, blinded, ect and you’ll be doing things like regeneration and temporary speed boosts.
Thalore
Wrath of the Woods
Unchanged other than the global first talent cooldown reduction via invested points, this is still one of the better racials for anyone increasing willpower [thus, it’s really really good for Wyrmics actually]. Increase both your +damage all and +resist all for 5 turns and be happy about it.
Unshackled
This is a physical and mental save raising talent, increasing both by 5 for every point invested. Now that saves can make a difference, talents like these can actually be pretty good.
Guardian of the Wood
Granting disease and blight resistance, this is mostly a late game benefactor [see orc spell casters] – but can prove useful in the mid game as well if there are no better options for generic points then.
Nature’s Pride
I love talents like this. Without a cost, it grants you two well and hardy meat shields that can also attack, having both good ranks in Stun and Knockback. The fact that it’s two of them is what is really good here – that’s two more bodies for npcs to have to deal with, and makes it to where you will only be a target for a 1/3 of the time instead of all the time. Granted, they are only here for six turns, it might be best to use this as an escaping talent. This doesn’t have the same impact as some of the other lvl 4 racials, but is still very good for what it can be used for. [Note: the Treants are immobile though, so be sure to place them near you and in the path of the enemy]
Dwarf
Resilience of the Dwarves
This is still awesome, and in fact, seems a little bit better than before. Use it often.
Stoneskin
Acting as a sort of partial passive Resilience, this will increase your armor by 3/invested point. The 15% chance may seem small, but you’ll be surprised how often it’ll activate. If you are going into melee combat often [such as a Fighter, Berserker or Sun Paladin] this might be worth investing in. Otherwise, ignore.
Power is Money
This can either be fantastic or not very good. As it effects all three saves based on the amount of gold you posses, if you don’t mind not shopping very often, then you can become a very hardy dwarf [especially when Resilience is up]
Stone Walking
This is essentially the dwarf racial from T2 or a single use Probability Travel without a cost. This is the kind of escape option that players dream of, and it’s here. It’s not quiet a one point wonder however, as a lot of walls are more than 1 tile thick. I advise anyone not playing a dwarf mage or shadowblade to check this one out, it is probably one of the best racial options available.
Halfling
Luck of the Little Folk
Scaling with Cun, this was the original Magic of the Eternals talent. Increases crit chance for both physical and magical attacks.
Duck and Dodge
This is mostly useful when fighting in areas that have large npcs usually, such as the Daikara – otherwise things that are only one size category bigger than you won’t feel much of a difference with this yet.
Militant Mind
This is a really good talent as passive investment in most any case. It directly effects damage that you’ll do in any way, and increases it based on the number of visible npcs. So, places with summoners and pits are not so tough anymore for the little guys.
Indomitable
This is what the movement infusion was trying to be, only this is good. The duration is decent and the cooldown can be dropped pretty low. This isn’t a blow me a way kind of talent, but it is extremely useful.
Yeek
Dominant Will
Still really good as a charm effect that ends in death. Think of this as having a mini temporary golem just about anytime you want.
Unity
Confuse and Silence res along with mental save boost – passively!? This is screaming for more Yeek Archmages…
Quickened
A passive increase to global speed is rocking, ofcourse, but at only 0.03 per point, it is very low. Unless you are wanting to try out a passively fast build [say with a shadowblade doing Essence of Speed and other nonsense] then this is a give or take talent.
Wayist
Summons up to 3 yeeks that are kinda weak but with no duration they stick around until they die. This makes this a useful controlling talent as it will take up space [instead of being a mainly defensive talent like the Treant summoning one]. The summoned yeeks come with talents and kit, but like any yeek, they are weak.
Gift of the Pureborn
A solid regeneration if you are already focusing on willpower, otherwise, points invested might not be that good of an idea. It isn’t strong enough to replace a regeneration rune, but, if for example, you were going to play a Wilder of some kind, then a Higher is definitely a good choice because of this talent.
Overseer of Nations
This is a unique talent and a very good one at that. It is pretty simple to, for every point invested; you gain 1 more tile of vision. No, this is not infravision or a light radius; it is just that much further for you to see. Now, in some cases this isn’t worth all that much because you won’t have a light radius greater than eight or so, but a lot of dungeons are fully and perm lit, such as the Old Forest and the Orc Prides – so it gives you a drop on npcs from a distance that they won’t be capable of seeing you from. Think of it as a passive, non magic detection spell in such cases.
Born into Magic
This is maybe a bit too niche to be too useful as Arcane damage is relatively rare for the player to be faced with, and there are many sources of increased spell save. For now, I’d leave it either alone completely or only invest a single point. But, as more spells/things do Arcane damage, the better this will get.
Highborn’s Bloom
This is just absolutely insanely good. This is one of two ways that you can recover Stamina without waiting and it effects ALL your resources, so if you nabbed something that requires mana and you have stamina and vim or some other concoction, this recovers some for all of them. This is the ultimate second breathe talent and as far as I’m concerned, if you find yourself over exhausted with resources, consider taking this talent. It is amazing.
Shalore
Grace of the Eternals
Dexterity based Global speed increase. If going dexterity already, then this is amazing. If not, and you can spare say 30 points for dex and you’ll be using equipment to raise it, then this is a good one to invest in. It’s not quite as god awful good as it was in comparison to the other options now available to players, but it is still really really good.
Magic of the Eternals
If you want to blast things to bits with crits, then here is your new favorite talent. All ways you can crit are increased in chance with this talent, and while it might scale a little low, if you are attacking in multiple ways [say physically and with spells] then this is probably worth it.
Secretes of the Eternals
While this invisibility effect does run off of Magic [making it almost specialized for Shadowblades], it is decent enough as is. The greater the amount of hp you have though, the less dangerous it is to ‘try’ and trigger this. It’s more of a slightly helpful triggered escape talent than anything else, but if you are investing in magic, you probably will like this one a lot, especially if you are a Reaver or Corrupter.
Timeless
This works as advertised: Beneficial timed effects are elongated and baneful timed effects are shortened. The more points invested, the shorter the cooldown and the bigger the difference in durations. This is a great talent for late game when you are always getting diseased, poisoned, blinded, ect and you’ll be doing things like regeneration and temporary speed boosts.
Thalore
Wrath of the Woods
Unchanged other than the global first talent cooldown reduction via invested points, this is still one of the better racials for anyone increasing willpower [thus, it’s really really good for Wyrmics actually]. Increase both your +damage all and +resist all for 5 turns and be happy about it.
Unshackled
This is a physical and mental save raising talent, increasing both by 5 for every point invested. Now that saves can make a difference, talents like these can actually be pretty good.
Guardian of the Wood
Granting disease and blight resistance, this is mostly a late game benefactor [see orc spell casters] – but can prove useful in the mid game as well if there are no better options for generic points then.
Nature’s Pride
I love talents like this. Without a cost, it grants you two well and hardy meat shields that can also attack, having both good ranks in Stun and Knockback. The fact that it’s two of them is what is really good here – that’s two more bodies for npcs to have to deal with, and makes it to where you will only be a target for a 1/3 of the time instead of all the time. Granted, they are only here for six turns, it might be best to use this as an escaping talent. This doesn’t have the same impact as some of the other lvl 4 racials, but is still very good for what it can be used for. [Note: the Treants are immobile though, so be sure to place them near you and in the path of the enemy]
Dwarf
Resilience of the Dwarves
This is still awesome, and in fact, seems a little bit better than before. Use it often.
Stoneskin
Acting as a sort of partial passive Resilience, this will increase your armor by 3/invested point. The 15% chance may seem small, but you’ll be surprised how often it’ll activate. If you are going into melee combat often [such as a Fighter, Berserker or Sun Paladin] this might be worth investing in. Otherwise, ignore.
Power is Money
This can either be fantastic or not very good. As it effects all three saves based on the amount of gold you posses, if you don’t mind not shopping very often, then you can become a very hardy dwarf [especially when Resilience is up]
Stone Walking
This is essentially the dwarf racial from T2 or a single use Probability Travel without a cost. This is the kind of escape option that players dream of, and it’s here. It’s not quiet a one point wonder however, as a lot of walls are more than 1 tile thick. I advise anyone not playing a dwarf mage or shadowblade to check this one out, it is probably one of the best racial options available.
Halfling
Luck of the Little Folk
Scaling with Cun, this was the original Magic of the Eternals talent. Increases crit chance for both physical and magical attacks.
Duck and Dodge
This is mostly useful when fighting in areas that have large npcs usually, such as the Daikara – otherwise things that are only one size category bigger than you won’t feel much of a difference with this yet.
Militant Mind
This is a really good talent as passive investment in most any case. It directly effects damage that you’ll do in any way, and increases it based on the number of visible npcs. So, places with summoners and pits are not so tough anymore for the little guys.
Indomitable
This is what the movement infusion was trying to be, only this is good. The duration is decent and the cooldown can be dropped pretty low. This isn’t a blow me a way kind of talent, but it is extremely useful.
Yeek
Dominant Will
Still really good as a charm effect that ends in death. Think of this as having a mini temporary golem just about anytime you want.
Unity
Confuse and Silence res along with mental save boost – passively!? This is screaming for more Yeek Archmages…
Quickened
A passive increase to global speed is rocking, ofcourse, but at only 0.03 per point, it is very low. Unless you are wanting to try out a passively fast build [say with a shadowblade doing Essence of Speed and other nonsense] then this is a give or take talent.
Wayist
Summons up to 3 yeeks that are kinda weak but with no duration they stick around until they die. This makes this a useful controlling talent as it will take up space [instead of being a mainly defensive talent like the Treant summoning one]. The summoned yeeks come with talents and kit, but like any yeek, they are weak.
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Re: Race decision: which race trees are useful?
MOVEMENT INFUSION.... OMW. (Not tested...)edge2054 wrote:I also played a Shalore Zerker a bit.
Timeless is really nice but it's 5 more turns to your good stuff and 10 off the bad or at least that's how I read it. Also 5 more turns of bloodbath or resolve isn't anything special, both of these buffs over write (like stun) and you'll lose the 5 bonus turns as soon as it goes off again. However... 5 more turns of wild infusion, regen infusion, or perfect strikes is really nice, especially considering you can pop both infusions and perfect strikes on one turn and timeless on the next and clear your infusion saturation
Re: Race decision: which race trees are useful?
Canderel wrote:MOVEMENT INFUSION.... OMW. (Not tested...)edge2054 wrote:I also played a Shalore Zerker a bit.
Timeless is really nice but it's 5 more turns to your good stuff and 10 off the bad or at least that's how I read it. Also 5 more turns of bloodbath or resolve isn't anything special, both of these buffs over write (like stun) and you'll lose the 5 bonus turns as soon as it goes off again. However... 5 more turns of wild infusion, regen infusion, or perfect strikes is really nice, especially considering you can pop both infusions and perfect strikes on one turn and timeless on the next and clear your infusion saturation
Nah, well.. at least not the movement part. It breaks on talent usage remember
Timeless is a talent.Finalmaster, the Treants aren't immobile. That's a monster type tag you're seeing in the lua and without the never_move flag it doesn't mean what you think it does. Thalore treants are just as mobile as npc treants. Otherwise a pretty solid assessment of the talents.