Shop Price rebalancing

[Grey]

I personally think the following changes should be made to shop prices:

- Egos should be cheaper. Currently they're far too easy a source of gold. Often their price is misleading about their quality too (a sword with 3 APR is priced higher than a regular sword doing 5 more damage).

- Potions of healing should be cheaper. Why pay 3 gold per potion when a couple of minutes in the trollshaws will get you 10? Allowing players to buy their only source of healing would prevent necessary scumming instead. A price of 1 gold would be fairer (in line with scrolls of identify).

I'm sure others can suggest further tweaks.

[darkgod]

I was thinking of given gold caps to the stores, to prevent inflation.
Or maybe eve prevent selling at all.
I want gold to be a ressource to manage, not something you were for 5 levels and then are rich enough

[Feanor.81]

Actually, what is it gold for? I never bought anything from a shop after hitting level 5 or so (usually, just some basic starter piece of armor). Could we add some trainers or vendors here and there who take HUGE amounts of gold to respectively teach you in the talent categories or raise your stats, and sell you items which do the equivalent (potions of *stat*, potions of increasing *energy_pool*, books of *talent*, etc.)?

Side note: I would avoid preventing selling at all, it would make useless efforts a lot of good, hardly obtained drops.

[Grey]

Gold caps would make a lot of sense. As long as they naturally restore over time, and obviously restore when you buy things from them.

Or perhaps variable sell prices - the more you sell the less you get paid. Perhaps mitigated somewhat by higher cunning.

What I'd really love to see is Nethack/ADOM style stores, complete with options to rob Right now the towns feel like a spaced out menu screen.

Feanor.81: I'm always buying out identify scrolls and healing potions. I burn through them very fast. Early game gold can be tight for that reason - later on it's more an achievement measure.

Hmm, the more I think about the more it makes sense not to allow sales at all. Would stop me hoarding junk all the time for a few measly pieces I don't even need.

[Susramanian]

I think a lot of people would be surprised at how much more fun these types of games get when you can't sell anything. It makes you realize how much time you spend agonizing over how to pack your bags for the return trip to town. Massively boost gold drops, turn off selling to stores, and it will remove a great weight from our (and our characters') shoulders. Oh, and if we're worried about devaluing certain items which are only really good for selling, then that means those items need to change.

Go for it, Darkgod! We'll be thanking you for years.

[Burb Lulls]

Yes, plus, if you put excellent equipment in shops for sky-high prices, you'll actually find yourself becoming excited at finding large amounts of gold! It could almost be a viable vault reward in sufficient quantities!

It really says a lot about roguelike economics that people are flabbergasted when money is actually worth something.

[Grey]

Only problem is that items advertised in shops disappear when you go off adventuring. Currently you can decide to sell everything you have to try and get the cool ego item or artifact that has appeared in one store. If you can't sell then it's just a matter of luck as to whether or not you can buy an item you see.

Perhaps one could register an interest in an item and a shopkeeper will keep it on hold for you in future?

[darkgod]

Stores restock after 1000 turns, if you express an interrest in an object the shopkeepr could maybe tell you something like that "Ok I'l keep it in store for you but when you come to buy it later it'll cost you X% more, upkeep fee."

And yes not being able to sell stuff + autoid of basic stuff would mean much less burden on the player and allow to concentrate on important stuff: having fun

[edge2054]

Perhaps one could register an interest in an item and a shopkeeper will keep it on hold for you in future?

Assuming someone else doesn't buy it? (rng chance each game day?)

@DG Or maybe require a down payment equal to 10 or 20% of the item cost? Could base that on cunning....

Making gold actually worth something maybe adding some general shop bonuses for high cunning (and penalties for monster races).

[darkgod]

Ah yes pay a fee in advance works also.

So we all agree no selling is good ?
(and yes it makes gold drops much more interretsing, and a dragon hoard much better)

[edge2054]

I like the idea. Though I think the price of potions should come down a bit.

[Grey]

Certainly worth trying out in a beta to see how well it works. May need to up gold drops to compensate - will have to see.

I still want cheaper healing potions by the way.

[Feanor.81]

Yeah, worth a try, I surely am not against it, since I really had not figured out yet what should I do with gold, but I'm already wondering if inducing this way a 'trash' effect on some really good drops (I mean artifacts and great egos) will have some nasty side effect in terms of enjoying.

Also... wouldn't encumbrance become an almost nonexistent problem? What for that Cunning / Packing talent tree (well, most of it, I can still see some use for Pack Rat and Insulating Packing).

What I want to say here is: let's accurately ponder what is going to happen if we remove item selling (and thus, item collecting) from the game...

[Taxorgian]

How in the world will melee types survive without being able to buy mountains of (greater) healing potions? If you just make gold drops larger then it will rebalance where and how long you spend time (I always clear out the Maze now because of all the ego steel daggers; if they were unusable for anyone but that handful of classes I'd always beeline for the downstairs...).

[teachu2die]

i've played a roguelike or two with the no selling option and found it terribly frustrating, actually. not only was i very poor, but i felt like a kind of important component of the game (treasure hunting) was taken away.
i think the way gold works now is pretty good. by level 13-15 i usually have just enough extra money to buy a ring or two and maybe a nice ego weapon. i have never, even with my very high level characters, been able to afford any artifact in a shop.