New Afflicted class: Fallen

[Delmuir]

I agree 100% with all of that. Excellent!

[jaumito]

What's the rationale for making this class Celestial-based and deal darkness damage, by the way? Since the idea is to make others suffer through what is, basically, pain transfer, and you suffer in mind and body, wouldn't it make more sense for your class to deal part-mind, part-physical damage (maybe a new damage type), or your choice of either? This way you could tune the damage you deal depending on your opponent: transfer your headaches to physical-resistant enemies, transfer your own gashing wounds to the solipsist-like guys. Heck, now that I think about it, wouldn't it be cool to transfer bleeds, diseases, and other status effects that deal damage to enemies? A talent like that would make the Fallen a truly unique class.

By the way, I think Flagellant would be a better (as in, funnier) name. Idea: give the class access to exotic weapons mastery - whips would fit in well with the theme (too bad there aren't flails in ToME.)

[grayswandir]

By the way, I think Flagellant would be a better (as in, funnier) name. Idea: give the class access to exotic weapons mastery - whips would fit in well with the theme (too bad there aren't flails in ToME.)

But then I won't be able to make a Fallen Fallen!

[Red]

Pain Inversion/Wrath: Does it double pain and add the cost of the damage dealt back? You say each ability that uses pain requires pain equal to the damage inflicted. So if you have Wrath active and take 100 damage, you would gain 200 pain. However, you'd also deal 100 damage right back to the enemy, which would normally cost 100 pain, making it basically a free, 100% damage reflection. How exactly will this ability work?

[Delmuir]

What's the rationale for making this class Celestial-based and deal darkness damage, by the way? Since the idea is to make others suffer through what is, basically, pain transfer, and you suffer in mind and body, wouldn't it make more sense for your class to deal part-mind, part-physical damage (maybe a new damage type), or your choice of either? This way you could tune the damage you deal depending on your opponent: transfer your headaches to physical-resistant enemies, transfer your own gashing wounds to the solipsist-like guys. Heck, now that I think about it, wouldn't it be cool to transfer bleeds, diseases, and other status effects that deal damage to enemies? A talent like that would make the Fallen a truly unique class.

Good points!

1. My rationale? Yeah… I didn't put a lot of thought into this. Like most of my ideas, I'm just throwing it out into the crowd and see what the feedback is like.

2. Transferring wounds, etc? Yeah, I'm on board with that. If you have an idea, suggest a skill… most of you cats are better at this than I am so I'm more than open to any and all suggestions. Take possession of this idea if you like it!

Red,

About your question… I'm not sure. I'll have to think about it. Suggestions? I'm open.

What I'm really trying to do is to figure out how to change the game-play dynamic away from the norm. To that end, I REALLY like the idea of transferring and reflecting damage (including wounds and poisons, etc. It would mesh well with Vile Life). All too obviously, I haven't worked out exactly how to do this but that's the goal: a character who endures and then has to manage the PAIN.

[Red]

Category: Feel My Pain

Mirrored Pain
Basic attack/mobility thing, a short range attack that does minor damage and moves you adjacent to your target. Consumes a lot of extra pain.

Laceration
Gives your opponent 1-5 bleeding/cut/stuff like that debuffs. Takes away an equal number of any physical debuffs on you, but if you have less than the amount given, inflict some of the same debuffs you gave to your opponent. (E.g., you give 5 debuffs and have a stun, daze, pin, and bleed on you, you'll remove all four, but then give yourself another bleed debuff.)

Mental Anguish
As Laceration, but mind.

Taking You With Me
Give the targeted enemy a pain resource. Their pain bar is 1-.2 times as large as it would normally be, and they take 1-3 times as much pain as they should. (No idea if this would be a good idea, but - it. Do with it what you will.)

Pain Inversion/Wrath
Make it targetable. For that enemy, you take normal damage. However, it also takes the same damage, and its damage is 100% penetrating.

[Red]

OH! Delmuir, you say you want this class to have a new kind of gameplay style. Have you considered finding a way to make this anti-wildgift? Anti-magic is well estabilished and common, but there's really not much that goes directly against non magic classes. Not sure what would be worked into this class, but perhaps give it anti-specializations? Anti-wild, anti-psi, and anti-any non magic resource I missed that isn't Stamina.

[jaumito]

Take possession of this idea if you like it!

I must admit I'm tempted, even though I haven't any experience in lua programming.

Although, if I were to derive a class out of this (Flagellant), it'd probably be a semi-meleer who focuses pain through whips (make whips more effective, mostly through on-hit debuff and transfer procs), so not exactly what you had in mind.

[Delmuir]

Take possession of this idea if you like it!

I must admit I'm tempted, even though I haven't any experience in lua programming.

Although, if I were to derive a class out of this (Flagellant), it'd probably be a semi-meleer who focuses pain through whips (make whips more effective, mostly through on-hit debuff and transfer procs), so not exactly what you had in mind.

Eh. I'm unlikely to spend time developing this myself so if you like some of the ideas and want to incorporate them into something that you already had in mind, go for it!

Red,
Interesting ideas all. I'm not sure if I'm the person to address an anti-wilder class as I'm not sure I know enough about the game to do it but I'm game to kick that idea around.

[Red]

Just seems like a bit of a lack in the game (antimagic faction! Antiwilder... one ability in Vile Life. And it hurts magic classes just about as hard.) and a new hate using class seems as good a place as any. And even if this class doesn't use hate anymore, it's still pretty pissed off at the world.

[Delmuir]

Just seems like a bit of a lack in the game (antimagic faction! Antiwilder... one ability in Vile Life. And it hurts magic classes just about as hard.) and a new hate using class seems as good a place as any. And even if this class doesn't use hate anymore, it's still pretty pissed off at the world.

I agree 100%. Admittedly, anti-magic users do have some disadvantages in terms of gear but I'm sure that will improve over time.

Consequently, I think there is plenty of room for this idea. I'm going to have to mull it over as I'd not considered it previously. Great suggestion!

[Red]

Woot! Wait a minute...

Crap, I love Wilder classes. I'm screwing myself over on rares something fierce, I am. Still, I do think this kind of thing would be a good addition-currently, non magic classes have a lot less fear on the world map than magis users do. Zigur patrols are irrelevant, and even when they are hostile (they were attacking my Wyrmic before he picked up any escort spells) they're not that dangerous when manaclash is off the table. And orc patrols, while still dangerous to Wilders, are a lot less dangerous because mage hunters aren't nearly as large a threat.

In other words, make this world even deadlier. Sweet jesus, I really must hate living.