Psionic class lore

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darkgod
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Re: Psionic class lore

#31 Post by darkgod »

Yes the exploratory farportal takes care to match survivable worlds.

Gods are also very local phenomenon, local to a single planet usually; stars are just that, stars (usually).
Gods should be understood as early, powerful, lifeforms native to a planet, nothing more really so each planet will work differently (or even not have gods at all it's not a requirement).

As for other worlds, yes there are very very different worlds that cant be reached by the player. The faeros homeworld is understood to be a very hot place for example ;)

The universe is homogeneous on the big laws: how physic works, how arcane forces are pervasive to its structure, ..
Nature, life, gods, .. those are all very specific things that happen in specific places.
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The Revanchist
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Re: Psionic class lore

#32 Post by The Revanchist »

darkgod wrote:Yes the exploratory farportal takes care to match survivable worlds.

...

As for other worlds, yes there are very very different worlds that cant be reached by the player. The faeros homeworld is understood to be a very hot place for example ;)
Aww... Although I suppose most players would be frustrated if the world they wind up in happens to be actually incompatible with them. Or chokes out all the light they can put out... Or spawns sentient murder-oozes from the walls frequently enough to make a vacation in the Slime Tunnels a good idea...
darkgod wrote:The universe is homogeneous on the big laws: how physic works, how arcane forces are pervasive to its structure, ..
Nature, life, gods, .. those are all very specific things that happen in specific places.
Is Psionic aptitude a local occurrence, or a big law?
Which would Blight fall under? Could we have Blight if we didn't have Nature to malign?

astreoth
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Re: Psionic class lore

#33 Post by astreoth »

so does this mean the universe itself, has a kind of structure similar to the ley lines that make up eyals local rules of magic. if their were intergalactic ley lines, taping them for power would be a good explanation of how the celestial classes get their power from the sun and moon.

okay assuming the above is true lemme see if I got this. in the maj'eyal universe the laws of magic are determined by the alignments of elemental threads with a macro universal weave of these threads setting some universal rules of magic (celestial magic maybe time too).
while micro weaves set the laws of individual worlds determining the existence number and power of gods, as well as the overarching nature of the world (its elements) and the life populating it. all life has some connection to these elemental threads setting exactly what kind of life it is and in the case of lifeforms with powerful conections to these threads giving magic like natural abilities such as dragons elemental powers, dwarven stone walking, etc.
magic is the direct taping of these threads for power while nature gifts are the manipulation of ones natural connection to these threads.

it's weird how a discussion about psionics has led to this at this point it looks like everything but psionics is related to ley lines.
Is Psionic aptitude a local occurrence, or a big law?
Which would Blight fall under? Could we have Blight if we didn't have Nature to malign?Post
vim is magically taping blight an invasive new thread in maj'eyal that seeks to spread throughout the ecosystem no idea where it comes from though pretty sure its a local occurrence it could possibly be the spellblaze connected a bunch of seperate worlds together and nature typically trying to fill what ever contains it the separate worlds are trying to spread throughout each other.

as for psionics all I got is that its a natural ability stemming from a particularly strong leyline connection, like dragons elemental affinity making it a local thing. or that psionics is a result of using the same mental affinitys used for magic and wild gifts to directly manipulate the physical world without touching ley lines making it as much of a big law as the ability to tap magical threads is.

darkgod
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Re: Psionic class lore

#34 Post by darkgod »

Mostly yes, although the threads stuff is more interpretation than anything.
The universe is not constitued of elements like fire & such; it's made just like our own of atoms, molecules, quarks, .. with a little bit more in the form of arcane force which allows to alter the rest.

"Sadly", arcane forces are not evenly spread in the universe. There are kind of wells from which it sprouts from, known to the sher'tuls as Manastars.
The closer you are to one the more power to tap on (Eyal's system is close to one).
The Sher'tuls didnt like that because they rely on it thus they made the farportals, whose primary function is NOT transportation of people or stuff but of arcane itself. (They do have shisp that can go FTL after all anyway).
That's why they channel so much power and when the mages tempered with them it didnt go well at all.
They have built structures around manastars that channel the energies into the farportal network which then redistributes them equaly over the places they've been to.
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astreoth
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Re: Psionic class lore

#35 Post by astreoth »

so mana stars power the natural universal mana network and the sher'tul built a farportal network to let them keep a consistant mana saturation wherever they go.

and the flying fortress is a spaceship so we can get space adventures when fully repairing it is put into the game.

as much as I like this explanation of magical forces this thread has gotten really off track from the problem of no canon explanation for psionic powers can we please get some kind of ingame explanation of how they work or at least can you tell us how it works here or give us some indication of when you do plan to put in an ingame explanation?

parcel
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Re: Psionic class lore

#36 Post by parcel »

darkgod wrote:Mostly yes, although the threads stuff is more interpretation than anything.
The universe is not constitued of elements like fire & such; it's made just like our own of atoms, molecules, quarks, .. with a little bit more in the form of arcane force which allows to alter the rest.

"Sadly", arcane forces are not evenly spread in the universe. There are kind of wells from which it sprouts from, known to the sher'tuls as Manastars.
The closer you are to one the more power to tap on (Eyal's system is close to one).
The Sher'tuls didnt like that because they rely on it thus they made the farportals, whose primary function is NOT transportation of people or stuff but of arcane itself. (They do have shisp that can go FTL after all anyway).
That's why they channel so much power and when the mages tempered with them it didnt go well at all.
They have built structures around manastars that channel the energies into the farportal network which then redistributes them equaly over the places they've been to.
Do you want to have mana being truly fundamental? My general interpretation of the class systems is that their theories are overencompassing and to some degree incompatible. OF COURSE archmages think they've reached a fundamental understanding of the universe with their discovery of a controlling element called aether, but I'd say that they are wrong. The aether is an abundant element on M'E, but I'd put it on par with the other 'cosmic' elements, blight, positive, and negative. Blight and arcane have a bit of a dual relationship in the same way that positive and negative do. Meanwhile, solipsists are sure that everything is mental and that with enough training, their mind could sustainably 'summon' the entire universe into a state that accords with their desires. They look at magic users and are pretty confident that magic is an odd specialty within their system, working with some fundamental patterns that they haven't bothered to analyze because their methods are 'higher' and 'better'. The mages, on the other hand, are fairly certain that psi manipulates an unknown element, perhaps something emergent from aether as it animates the souls of living things. Necromancy, in dealing with souls very closely, might have come close to penetrating the truth about the relationship between mind and soul, thus discovering psionics on its own, except that the social processes underlying necromancy are not amenable to the transmission of knowledge, open debate, and basic research.

Meanwhile, wilders generally think that Nature is the fundamental animus of everything, but are wrong, since Nature is an emergent aspect of the ecology. More advanced wilders sometimes understand this and despite their passion for Nature have been able to confirm through their bond with Nature that Nature is mortal. Destroy the biosphere, and Nature would no longer exist on M'E. However, the truly wise wilders that understand this about Nature will often equivocate between the idea that Nature is all-powerful and the idea that Nature Needs Our Help, because they are leaders among wilders and the equivocation serves a political purpose that serves their Nature-aligned ends.

There's a deeper way in which all of these things connect, but the deepest aspect of this view of the universe is dominated by unknown forces which actually are the source of everything.

edge2054
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Re: Psionic class lore

#37 Post by edge2054 »

astreoth wrote: vim is magically taping blight an invasive new thread in maj'eyal that seeks to spread throughout the ecosystem no idea where it comes from though pretty sure its a local occurrence it could possibly be the spellblaze connected a bunch of seperate worlds together and nature typically trying to fill what ever contains it the separate worlds are trying to spread throughout each other.
I always thought of it as pollution. Basically the mana that was brought in before the Spellblaze was too much and it tainted the local mana supply.

There's some interesting lore on Farportals, Point Zero, and the Spellblaze that was never published. Maybe Darkgod or I could clean it up a bit and figure out a place to put it into the game.

*edit* Was the spellblaze chronicles ever put in game? I'm reading it now. Interesting stuff :)
Last edited by edge2054 on Sat May 24, 2014 8:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Doctornull
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Re: Psionic class lore

#38 Post by Doctornull »

Vim is not just Blight, though it is related to Blight.

Vim is not just "tainted Mana", though it is related to casting fuel just like Mana.

Vim is at least partially life force, which is why Bloodcasting works, and why you get more Vim by killing and Drain-ing others.
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HousePet
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Re: Psionic class lore

#39 Post by HousePet »

And Blight is not just Blight.
Any severe disruption to local nature/biology will appear as blight damage. It doesn't need to be associated with the Blight power source.
Demons do blight damage because their nature/biology is vastly different from Eyal's.
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Re: Psionic class lore

#40 Post by Doctornull »

HousePet wrote:Demons do blight damage because their nature/biology is vastly different from Eyal's.
Except when they don't, of course.

Their nature / biology is whatever it is, but some of them throw fire / acid / cold / physical at you, just like the most Nature-hugging dragons who ever did frolic in fields of flowers at midsummer.
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Re: Psionic class lore

#41 Post by HousePet »

Well obviously they aren't doing blight damage when they aren't doing blight damage. :P
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Re: Psionic class lore

#42 Post by Doctornull »

HousePet wrote:Well obviously they aren't doing blight damage when they aren't doing blight damage. :P
Indeed.

On the subject of demons, should there be more PSYCHIC demons?

We have plenty of Psychic horrors.
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The Revanchist
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Re: Psionic class lore

#43 Post by The Revanchist »

Perhaps the demons aren't really built for Psionics?

If that isn't the case, then by all means: More psionic demons!

Also, do we know whether Urh'Rok is keeping his planet intact with Magic, or some other means? Holding on really, really hard? Using the sheer force or his will to keep the planet in check?

parcel
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Re: Psionic class lore

#44 Post by parcel »

I'd venture that the Spellblaze problem was more ecological than mechanical. As arcane forces are weak there, sunlight lacking, and blight abundant, the ecology has grown to depend on an absence of aether and low positive/light. The spellblaze sent a jolt of arcane, stripped away clouds of acid and shadow, and killed many of the 'plants' which serve as food and help to maintain adequate vim in planetary organisms. It was a major bummer, especially considering that the ecology depends on a complex web of vim exchange, among other things. When the spellblaze created shortage of vim-nutrients, the result was rampant cannibalism and a dark age.

Psionic demons should exist but I'd say that psionic tendancies are mostly seen in archaic and unintelligent forms, which reflect a shared ancestry with early horrors in an era of no sun, different elemental distributions, and possibly no local planets at all. The intelligent and governing demons, I suspect, may be of several species, but all probably tend toward talents in shapeshifting and muting the boundary between body and spirit. This is how I conceive of Urh'Rok, in many ways. Not a demon high-king, but a demon father, the original God who shifted his form so much in order to protect his children that he became largely bodiless and mindless, and no longer truly a God. His first-born children are, like him, mutable, wraithformed demons of shadowflame and bulk matter transport, but other demon types exist, and the mutability of the primary races tends to mean that there is an abundance of subraces and great variety overall in the form and inborn traits of demon sentients.

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Re: Psionic class lore

#45 Post by HousePet »

Since Psionics is harder than just using magic, and we have no evidence for any antipathy towards magic in Demon society, I think it is quite possible none of them have bothered with it.
They still have at least one god after all, who know what divine powers might be available to them?
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