I asked this a couple of times on tome chat, but I think it needs the response the forums can offer. What are all the things you like about this game? And I would assume that the list of things you don't like are very small, or the total effect is pretty small. Is this correct?
Looking forward to your replies!
What are all the things that you like about this game?
Moderator: Moderator
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Steven Aus
- Archmage
- Posts: 366
- Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2014 3:38 pm
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
How each class is different, or at least most are. Anorithils aren't just Archmages with an exmphasis on light and dark damage, Mindslayers and Solipsists both are capable of filling any role uniquely but are still different from one another, Skirmisher is pretty different from Archer even if you both use sling and shield.
I'm not crying. I'm offering a sacrifice to DarkGod in hopes he'll show favor to me.
It hasn't worked yet.
It hasn't worked yet.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I think it'd be a bit easier to ask what are the things you DONT like about this game. Things we like is going to sum up to "nearly everything"
That being said, here's what I DONT like...
1. Early game. It sucks. It's boring, its not interesting. Either put some more random content in besides alt versions of floors, or give us interesting characters or more compelling options. ADOMs early game dosent bother me because its always a challenge, it can be handled quite differently depending on the freedom given to players with hotzenplotz / sherrif, small cave, druid / elder, puppy etc.
2. Celestials. I posted about this in the ideas thread recently for their revamped resources, they're really cool but a PITA to play because resource management is mind numbingly boring for them.
3. Nothing for a player to do outside combat. The combat is great but it gets old. Elona and ADOM had great out of combat options, and plenty of skills that are used in combat are also used outside of combat.
That's really it in my complaint list...at least all that I can think of. Everything else is great.
You could argue that lost merchant is a "choice" and gives variety / options to the early game but really...no its not. There is literally no reason to side with the assassin lord past the first time. We dont even see the lost merchant as a "person to help", we see him as "the key to open really good gear"
Flames of Uhr'Rok is a good example of an interesting early game. I had more than one "oh shit...this is messed up" or "Wow...this is starting to make a lot of sense" moments. Base game needs more cool stuff like flames. Or really cool NPCs like Hotzenplotz
That being said, here's what I DONT like...
1. Early game. It sucks. It's boring, its not interesting. Either put some more random content in besides alt versions of floors, or give us interesting characters or more compelling options. ADOMs early game dosent bother me because its always a challenge, it can be handled quite differently depending on the freedom given to players with hotzenplotz / sherrif, small cave, druid / elder, puppy etc.
2. Celestials. I posted about this in the ideas thread recently for their revamped resources, they're really cool but a PITA to play because resource management is mind numbingly boring for them.
3. Nothing for a player to do outside combat. The combat is great but it gets old. Elona and ADOM had great out of combat options, and plenty of skills that are used in combat are also used outside of combat.
That's really it in my complaint list...at least all that I can think of. Everything else is great.
You could argue that lost merchant is a "choice" and gives variety / options to the early game but really...no its not. There is literally no reason to side with the assassin lord past the first time. We dont even see the lost merchant as a "person to help", we see him as "the key to open really good gear"
Flames of Uhr'Rok is a good example of an interesting early game. I had more than one "oh shit...this is messed up" or "Wow...this is starting to make a lot of sense" moments. Base game needs more cool stuff like flames. Or really cool NPCs like Hotzenplotz
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LordKarasuman
- Halfling
- Posts: 82
- Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2013 12:33 am
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I do like that the early game (for most races) does a good job of easing you into the game, though.
What I like is the same thing as Red: class variance. I feel like darkgod went the "Make everything unique! Balance everything later!" approach, and that's honestly the way I prefer it for games like this.
What I like is the same thing as Red: class variance. I feel like darkgod went the "Make everything unique! Balance everything later!" approach, and that's honestly the way I prefer it for games like this.
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breadsmith
- Thalore
- Posts: 169
- Joined: Fri May 17, 2013 6:15 am
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I like vomiting on my enemies then rolling around in it to heal.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
Like a lot of people, I like winning ^^
Oh and the gameplay is superior to any other game I've ever played, so that's a bonus.
Oh and the gameplay is superior to any other game I've ever played, so that's a bonus.
tomisgo
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I like:
-Very high replay value thanks to the variety of classes
-No healing potions, no hunger, no running to town to sell loot
-Lore is mildly interesting
I don't like:
-Bullshit overpowered rares that can kill you in one turn
-The Eastern continent feels empty compared to the West
-Melinda quest is cringeworthy
-Very high replay value thanks to the variety of classes
-No healing potions, no hunger, no running to town to sell loot
-Lore is mildly interesting
I don't like:
-Bullshit overpowered rares that can kill you in one turn
-The Eastern continent feels empty compared to the West
-Melinda quest is cringeworthy
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
Sradac, lets switch save files! I enjoy the early game a lot while the end game (lv30+ / East) gets boring for me.
Stronk is a potent combatant with a terrifying appearance.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
Likes:
*Epicness! (hard to explain but people who now what I'm talking about know what I'm talking about)
*Music (I would actually consider listening to some of this music outside of the game. That's a pretty good sign).
*Imaginative classes (oozemancer, solipsist, wtf?)
*The game doesn't end when winning (additional bosses, additional difficulties etc.)
*Replayability
*The World
*Wildfire
*Online character vault
Dislikes
*Unpolished (bugs, graphical effects/terrain objects hard to detect etc.)
*Unbalanced (the difficulty of monsters is way way too varied, too many s h i t monsters, some monsters absurdly strong, some skills/prodigies are completely useless in comparison to alternatives etc..)
*Tediousness! (escorts, activated scouting abilities can be used at will, useless hording of equipment to meet the stat requirements for skills and prodigies, remembering what the last four skills were so you can float points, rare drowning, hate management on doomed etc..)
*Too long (on the other hand, I like the option to have extra s h i t to do after you have won if you feel like it).
Final Verdict: The second best roguelike I've played/seen played after DCSS. DCSS is superiorly polished and more balanced but has the flavor of a cardboard box compared to TOME. I really liked FTL's gameplay too, but the game has laughable replayability compared to TOME so it can't really compete with TOME.
Played heavily: Nethack, ADOM, FTL, TOME, DCSS, Linley's Dungeon Crawl (this is what was before DCSS), DoomRL
Very briefly tried or aware of existing and being somewhat aware of what they are about but which haven't really interested me enough to play a lot: Many, many others (Dwarf Fortress, Angband vanilla etc.)
Interested in trying next: Brogue.
I guess this is a review now, lol.
*Epicness! (hard to explain but people who now what I'm talking about know what I'm talking about)
*Music (I would actually consider listening to some of this music outside of the game. That's a pretty good sign).
*Imaginative classes (oozemancer, solipsist, wtf?)
*The game doesn't end when winning (additional bosses, additional difficulties etc.)
*Replayability
*The World
*Wildfire
*Online character vault
Dislikes
*Unpolished (bugs, graphical effects/terrain objects hard to detect etc.)
*Unbalanced (the difficulty of monsters is way way too varied, too many s h i t monsters, some monsters absurdly strong, some skills/prodigies are completely useless in comparison to alternatives etc..)
*Tediousness! (escorts, activated scouting abilities can be used at will, useless hording of equipment to meet the stat requirements for skills and prodigies, remembering what the last four skills were so you can float points, rare drowning, hate management on doomed etc..)
*Too long (on the other hand, I like the option to have extra s h i t to do after you have won if you feel like it).
Final Verdict: The second best roguelike I've played/seen played after DCSS. DCSS is superiorly polished and more balanced but has the flavor of a cardboard box compared to TOME. I really liked FTL's gameplay too, but the game has laughable replayability compared to TOME so it can't really compete with TOME.
Played heavily: Nethack, ADOM, FTL, TOME, DCSS, Linley's Dungeon Crawl (this is what was before DCSS), DoomRL
Very briefly tried or aware of existing and being somewhat aware of what they are about but which haven't really interested me enough to play a lot: Many, many others (Dwarf Fortress, Angband vanilla etc.)
Interested in trying next: Brogue.
I guess this is a review now, lol.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
What I like most: the inscription system. Way better than potions and stuff you see in other games.
What I really don't like: the saves/immunities dichotomy. That part is poorly designed IMO.
What I really don't like: the saves/immunities dichotomy. That part is poorly designed IMO.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
what I like about this game
1: talent tree
what i like about the talent trees of each class... is that there isn't any.
they are all packed in groups of 4, (except for basic armour and weapon training)
each class start with a few packs opened, and if you feel like it, you can open another one.
2: mirror encounter
while classes are very different from each other, you are not the only one.
all the talents you have, are not yours alone, and you can find an enemy using same spells or techniques as you.
most of the enemies actually have talents that can be found in either class.
3: adventurer class
don't feel like playing suggested class? you can play anything you want.
how about arcane brawler? (that one is quite good actually)
4: outside talents
there are some talents, that can be acquired by any class. (except for oozemancer. he will never obtain magical talents.)
5:bosses with personality.
Majority of the bosses have some sort of story or personality.
-a thief that has been possessed (alt kor'pul)
-a cruel but cheerful necromancer (dreadfall)
-a mage trying to destroy the zigur (spell blaze mark)
-crazy tempest (tempest peak)
-subject z (ruined halfling complex)
-ice-fire Ork (Reknor)
6: the unexpected
one time when I jumped into my exploratory farportal...
1: talent tree
what i like about the talent trees of each class... is that there isn't any.
they are all packed in groups of 4, (except for basic armour and weapon training)
each class start with a few packs opened, and if you feel like it, you can open another one.
2: mirror encounter
while classes are very different from each other, you are not the only one.
all the talents you have, are not yours alone, and you can find an enemy using same spells or techniques as you.
most of the enemies actually have talents that can be found in either class.
3: adventurer class
don't feel like playing suggested class? you can play anything you want.
how about arcane brawler? (that one is quite good actually)
4: outside talents
there are some talents, that can be acquired by any class. (except for oozemancer. he will never obtain magical talents.)
5:bosses with personality.
Majority of the bosses have some sort of story or personality.
-a thief that has been possessed (alt kor'pul)
-a cruel but cheerful necromancer (dreadfall)
-a mage trying to destroy the zigur (spell blaze mark)
-crazy tempest (tempest peak)
-subject z (ruined halfling complex)
-ice-fire Ork (Reknor)
6: the unexpected
one time when I jumped into my exploratory farportal...
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I like most things about the game. Definitely the best roguelike game I've played. Some highlights:
1. Very few consumables. I always hate consumables in games because I feel the need to hoard them and not use them "in case I need them later." The inscription system is brilliant, and classes that do use consumables (e.g., Alchemist) are able to create their own supply.
2. Streamlined gameplay. There may be a handful of complaining points here, but for the most part the game avoids making you do tedious things like running to town constantly or hitting enemies repeatedly to gain skills. If you think ToME is anywhere near tedious, try playing NetHack sometime.
3. Farming is not necessary. This is a big win from a design perspective. Too many games, either roguelike or roguelike-inspired, encourage you to grind easy enemies for XP and loot. While farming is technically possible in ToME with farportals, it's dangerous and strictly optional.
4. Classes are varied and interesting. There are certain classes that never really appealed to me, but overall the classes have a lot of flavor and playstyle variety. There is some power imbalance, but since it's a single-player game that isn't a major issue. The talent tree system allows for better customization than you find in many other games.
5. Active development and modding community. DarkGod does a great job with pushing out new content and fixes, not to mention fun little seasonal events. Extensibility through user-created addons is another major advantage, as it tends to be in any game that supports it. If you don't like something about the game or you're getting bored with the vanilla content, there are plenty of addons to tailor the game to your preferences.
6. Enemy variety. While you may fight a good deal of popcorn mobs like bears and worms, the game has good overall variety of monsters. Rare+ mobs also make the game much more interesting, since class variety carries over directly in mob variety. Fighting rare+ mobs can help you learn about other classes' skills, and if you already know about the different classes you don't need to learn a completely different set of mob abilities. It's a very efficient system. I would like to see new types of mobs added over time, though.
7. Different difficulty and permadeath settings. This further helps to let players tailor the gameplay to their own preferences. Newbies can learn the ropes on Exploration or Normal(Adventure), while the hardcore veterans can challenge themselves on Roguelike and Nightmare/Insane/Madness. Not to mention additional difficulty settings from addons.
8. Randomness within limits. Having some random elements helps with replayability and excitement, but many games fall in the trap of making everything random. ToME strikes a good balance of having random loot and (to some extent) enemies, but the overall campaign and character progression is consistent enough that winning doesn't feel like a coin flip. If you're a very skilled/knowledgeable player and have a strong character build, there are very few unwinnable situations. Most of the things players see as unfair are actually due to their own mistakes or inexperience; this is not true in all games.
9. Adventurer class! This is my overall favorite class because it allows a lot of creativity. It was a brilliant addition to the game.
10. Original story/lore. I'm not generally a lore-hound, but I do take the time to read it in this game and find it adds a lot of flavor. Although the game contains many typical fantasy tropes like orcs/elves/ogres, they are given an original spin rather than being ripped directly from a D&D book. The amount and variety of lore snippets available in game is also great. They range from serious to humorous.
The number of things I dislike about the game is relatively small. Those things are also handled in Ideas/Bugs threads, so I won't reiterate here.
1. Very few consumables. I always hate consumables in games because I feel the need to hoard them and not use them "in case I need them later." The inscription system is brilliant, and classes that do use consumables (e.g., Alchemist) are able to create their own supply.
2. Streamlined gameplay. There may be a handful of complaining points here, but for the most part the game avoids making you do tedious things like running to town constantly or hitting enemies repeatedly to gain skills. If you think ToME is anywhere near tedious, try playing NetHack sometime.
3. Farming is not necessary. This is a big win from a design perspective. Too many games, either roguelike or roguelike-inspired, encourage you to grind easy enemies for XP and loot. While farming is technically possible in ToME with farportals, it's dangerous and strictly optional.
4. Classes are varied and interesting. There are certain classes that never really appealed to me, but overall the classes have a lot of flavor and playstyle variety. There is some power imbalance, but since it's a single-player game that isn't a major issue. The talent tree system allows for better customization than you find in many other games.
5. Active development and modding community. DarkGod does a great job with pushing out new content and fixes, not to mention fun little seasonal events. Extensibility through user-created addons is another major advantage, as it tends to be in any game that supports it. If you don't like something about the game or you're getting bored with the vanilla content, there are plenty of addons to tailor the game to your preferences.
6. Enemy variety. While you may fight a good deal of popcorn mobs like bears and worms, the game has good overall variety of monsters. Rare+ mobs also make the game much more interesting, since class variety carries over directly in mob variety. Fighting rare+ mobs can help you learn about other classes' skills, and if you already know about the different classes you don't need to learn a completely different set of mob abilities. It's a very efficient system. I would like to see new types of mobs added over time, though.
7. Different difficulty and permadeath settings. This further helps to let players tailor the gameplay to their own preferences. Newbies can learn the ropes on Exploration or Normal(Adventure), while the hardcore veterans can challenge themselves on Roguelike and Nightmare/Insane/Madness. Not to mention additional difficulty settings from addons.
8. Randomness within limits. Having some random elements helps with replayability and excitement, but many games fall in the trap of making everything random. ToME strikes a good balance of having random loot and (to some extent) enemies, but the overall campaign and character progression is consistent enough that winning doesn't feel like a coin flip. If you're a very skilled/knowledgeable player and have a strong character build, there are very few unwinnable situations. Most of the things players see as unfair are actually due to their own mistakes or inexperience; this is not true in all games.
9. Adventurer class! This is my overall favorite class because it allows a lot of creativity. It was a brilliant addition to the game.
10. Original story/lore. I'm not generally a lore-hound, but I do take the time to read it in this game and find it adds a lot of flavor. Although the game contains many typical fantasy tropes like orcs/elves/ogres, they are given an original spin rather than being ripped directly from a D&D book. The amount and variety of lore snippets available in game is also great. They range from serious to humorous.
The number of things I dislike about the game is relatively small. Those things are also handled in Ideas/Bugs threads, so I won't reiterate here.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
- eekayeek peeks around corner with eyes wide open
eekayeek summons slime into middle of thread
eekayeek waits
eekayeek's slime summon expires
eekayeek summons another slime into middle of thread
eekayeek waits
eekayeek's slime summon expires
eekayeek trembles
eekayeek haltingly steps around corner into thread
eekayeek's eyes dart about in fear
eekayeek trembles some more
eekayeek quickly speaks in a shaky, high-pitched voice: uuuhh.... I like the RPG aspects.
eekayeek runs back behind corner
eekayeek trembles and waits
The mods. Lots and lots and lots of mods. And even someone as ludicrously incompetent at coding as me (read: I can't) can do a little modding. Granted, not well, and nothing worth sharing. But I can. And that's impressive in and of itself.
Class choices. There are creative takes on traditional classes, as well as entirely new ideas, and there are enough choices to accomodate just about any play-style. (Some could probably use work to make them play better, but the foundation is there, and that's the point.)
When it comes to things I like and care about, I tend to focus on the parts or aspects I dislike. My intention is to find ways to improve them, though that doesn't always come across. If I didn't care, I wouldn't bother. There's lots I want to criticize about ToME, but I'll try to hold back (mostly because I have no ability to help implement anything). Sorry in advance.
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Death From Above
- Cornac
- Posts: 32
- Joined: Mon Mar 09, 2015 1:21 am
- Location: Parts Unknown
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
The variety of classes/races/playstyles is excellent and I would think most anyone should be able to find something that suits them. The TOME world is neat. This isn't a story heavy game but people with an imagination will probably find themselves filling in plenty of gaps on their own. I can't really remember playing a turn-based game where I actually enjoyed combat this much either. Also for a game with so many skilltrees I don't really get the sense so far that there are a lot of skills that are really the same damn thing with different names. It's pretty impressive.
The fact it actually offers an infinite lives mode. I get that there are serious roguelike junkies that probably find this offensive to their video game religion or whatever, but that's their problem. It makes this game much more accessible for new people, in my opinion, and it is a decent way to learn for a new player without the frustration of never seeing level 20 for a long time.
There is an item in the game called Bolbum's Big Knocker. I like to say Bolbum's Big Knocker. It's fun to say Bolbum's Big Knocker. It doesn't hurt that Bolbum's Big Knocker is also great with channel staff.
Only truly annoying thing for me is "lol two shot death". This is just boring and adds nothing. I don't like how equipment swapping can be used how to cheat your way into skills, but that's also a thing you can simply choose not to do on your own if you want. And I guess if you want to, who cares, it's your game. Have fun.
Overall it's a game that really has very few big flaws. Great game. I've played almost nothing else for the last month now and I've barely scratched the surface. I have serious doubts this will come out of my rotation for literally years to come.
The fact it actually offers an infinite lives mode. I get that there are serious roguelike junkies that probably find this offensive to their video game religion or whatever, but that's their problem. It makes this game much more accessible for new people, in my opinion, and it is a decent way to learn for a new player without the frustration of never seeing level 20 for a long time.
There is an item in the game called Bolbum's Big Knocker. I like to say Bolbum's Big Knocker. It's fun to say Bolbum's Big Knocker. It doesn't hurt that Bolbum's Big Knocker is also great with channel staff.
Only truly annoying thing for me is "lol two shot death". This is just boring and adds nothing. I don't like how equipment swapping can be used how to cheat your way into skills, but that's also a thing you can simply choose not to do on your own if you want. And I guess if you want to, who cares, it's your game. Have fun.
Overall it's a game that really has very few big flaws. Great game. I've played almost nothing else for the last month now and I've barely scratched the surface. I have serious doubts this will come out of my rotation for literally years to come.
I've killed a hell of a lot of people to get to this point, but I've only one more. The last one. The one I'm driving to right now. The only one left.
And when I arrive at my destination, I am gonna kill Bill.
And when I arrive at my destination, I am gonna kill Bill.
Re: What are all the things that you like about this game?
I like that this game broke the ASCII Dreams Roguelike of the Year award.