On Artifacts

[Repton]

Currently we have a few artifacts, but not very many. e.g. there are no artifact waraxes or maces, so fighters should use long swords and get Ringil. Some see this as a problem. DG has asked people to come up with new artifact ideas; let's assume for a moment that these ideas will be forthcoming.

It seems to me that there are a few ways the game could pan out:

1. One really good artifact in each object category. Basic game arc: your class determines the artifacts you need. If they're guaranteed, you do the quest and get them, else you scum until they turn up. Non-artifact equipment only matters to you until you get the artifact you want; after that, it's just loot for selling.

Pros: Game is more predictable, every class has access to the equipment it needs.
Cons: Devalues ego-items, may encourage scumming, game is more predictable.

2. Multiple good artifacts in each object category.

Pros: More variation in characters
Cons: Requires lots of artifacts, could dilute the quality of artifacts in the game, still devalues ego-items, even more encouraging of scumming

3. Torchlight-style: Lots of artifacts of various power levels, which get eclipsed by normal egos as the game progresses. e.g. you might find an artifact steel sword early on. It boosts some stats, grants some resistances .. but it's still only doing steel damage. At some point, you'll need to swap it for a non-artifact weapon, which will upgrade your damage, but you'll lose the other abilities.

Pros: More variation in characters, reduces scumming (because you know you'll find better gear as you progress), lets the player make real decisions instead of just assembling the standard ascension kit.
Cons: Devalues some artifacts (Ringil would be surpassed in damage by every mithril sword you find), requires lots of artifacts, could require major rebalancing.

[darkgod]

There is an other way

Taxo idea about doing something with artifacts you dont want.
Take ringil for example, you loot it and then if you dont use it you could give it back to the elves, who, grateful as they are would trade it to you for a nice artifact axe or mace of equivalent power.

Basically this allows to have fixed artifacts with thematic value (becasue a lot of boss dropping their named artifact just makes sense and the bosses are desined around wielding it in combat) and not restrict choices for the player, if their prefer axe/mace/...

[edge2054]

Turns out this was actually Repton's idea >.> (My bad actually, I brought it up in IRC yesterday and thought it was Taxo's thread and I imagine DG didn't double check. Sorry Repton).

Here's the original thread.

http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=3 ... t=artifact

The only drawback to this is workload (unless you count derandomization as a drawback but I for one don't) but DG sounds like he's on board so I suggest anyone that wants to contribute ideas or coded quests/artifacts to this project do so in said thread.

[darkgod]

Indeed!

[Feanor.81]

I still agree with Repton that random items (ego items or randarts) should eventually surpass any fixed, thematic artifact in the game. This greatly adds to game variety. No more wanted artifacts could still be used in an unique way to grant them a great value.

[Dervis]

My favourite artifacts in Tome 2.3.x were the sentient artifacts, with Mormegil managing to get my characters killed after some levels of feeling invincible. Seeing at least a couple of these would be pretty sweet.

[Burb Lulls]

There was a topic on sentient artifacts over here, http://forums.te4.org//viewtopic.php?f=39&t=22556, even though it essentially ended on Witch of Agnesi curves and the artifacts - eachother.

It's still a nice idea.

[Fela]

My favourite artifacts in Tome 2.3.x were the sentient artifacts, with Mormegil managing to get my characters killed after some levels of feeling invincible. Seeing at least a couple of these would be pretty sweet.

I also loved the daggers and sting with a passion. And oh the dread when they discovered earth..