ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 3:04 am 
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Archmage

Joined: Mon May 24, 2010 1:33 pm
Posts: 303
Just a silly idea I had for a rogue build. I really don't feel like testing it out, but I figured I might as well write it out if anyone else wants to give it a go.

The whole idea is to get the don't-break-stealth skill as high as possible. It's really pretty simple; get lucky day for the insane luck boost, and then put a category point into stealth, then get tricks of the trade to raise your stealth mastery up to 1.7. If you find a mastery amulet, that's even better. With both of those, your chance to stay in stealth should be.... something really high. Constant level 8.5 shadowstrikes should be fun, though getting a rogue to level 42 to try it is a bit daunting for me.

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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 12:50 pm 
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Wayist

Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2010 6:14 pm
Posts: 27
I tried this out multiple times over previous builds. To this day never managed to actually win the game with a rogue.

From memory there is a cut off point. I have a sneaky suspicion it is around 82-87% but can't remember from the top of my head. Luck or mastery definitely capped out whereby gaining more luck stopped increasing the percentage chance.

I am however currently around level 18 Skellie Rogue. I have found that Stealth isn't as good as it used to be especially until later on so always hold off til higher levels. Will let you know what I find :D


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PostPosted: Thu May 09, 2013 1:42 pm 
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Thalore

Joined: Mon Jan 21, 2013 4:29 am
Posts: 123
even with stealth at 1.9 or 2 breaking stealth depends on their see inv / stealth.... if its high enough you will break stealth


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:41 pm
Posts: 2
I just won with this build (lvl 50 skeleton rogue, winning on normal/roguelike, name "Earefast"). I picked up lucky day and tricks of the trade, and ended up getting Death's Embrace which gives an additional +0.10 Stealth mastery. With a cat point, prodigy, and that equip I had 1.80 mastery, resulting in a 91% unseen actions percent. With 45 luck (from lucky day and the alchemist potion) I had over 100% chance to not be seen on actions. The only way my stealth got broken is if an enemy succeeded a check against me, which wasn't often. I prioritized cunning and stealth bonus to avoid that, and ended the game with 118 cunning, 140.2 stealth score, and a shadowstrike of +128.57%.

This build absolutely *dominated* the endgame. Almost nothing could see me, and I was taking out 5k+ hp elites in two hits. I killed both of the high peak end bosses in less than 7 turns (thanks to Eden's Guile + Momentum abuse). This build is absolutely viable, even overpowered late game.


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PostPosted: Sun Aug 04, 2013 11:45 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 04, 2013 8:41 pm
Posts: 2
This was my exact build for my lvl 50 skeleton rogue winner, Earefast (won on normal/roguelike): http://te4.org/characters/11707/tome/26468838-b50b-4ec8-a2e0-c57e63ef935b

I put a category point into stealth, got tricks of the trade prodigy, and wore Death's Embrace for an additional +0.10 stealth mastery. So I ended up with 1.80 stealth mastery and unseen actions granting 91% chance to not break stealth. That plus over 45 luck from lucky day prodigy, alchemist potion, and other equips gave me 100+% chance to not break, aside from the breaks generated from failing the checks on melee attacks. I prioritized cunning and stealth bonus to prevent those though, and ended the game with over 140 stealth score.

This build absolutely dominates the endgame. I basically ran though all of the prides and High Peak with impunity, killing 5k-10k hp bosses and uniques with just a couple talents and almost never breaking stealth. By abusing Eden's Guile + Momentum I killed both of the endgame bosses in less than 7 turns. This build is totally viable, even overpowered, the only challenge is getting past the early and mid game. I only died once (used lvl 5 Skeleton Reassemble to resurrect), and that was 100% avoidable. I was drawing the OP drakes out of Vor's armory using an item's range 10 spell beam and accidentally used the rush talent, resulting in my immediate demise.


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PostPosted: Tue Aug 06, 2013 8:15 pm 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:46 pm
Posts: 2275
Location: Ambush!
Ooo, that looks like a fun build.

Thanks for the build link & after-action report!

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PostPosted: Mon Feb 03, 2014 9:07 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 10:08 am
Posts: 2
Hey, and what about nightmare difficulty? I've tried stealth, but even with 5/5 in this skill almost every enemy can see me (in tier 1 dungeons? i'm lvl 15 with 47 points in stealth). Should i take stealth later on, or on nm it's useless, becuse of enemys always have more lvl and see stelth than your staelth power?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 04, 2014 2:08 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2004 5:01 pm
Posts: 1303
Location: Finland
VenikSmerti wrote:
Hey, and what about nightmare difficulty? I've tried stealth, but even with 5/5 in this skill almost every enemy can see me (in tier 1 dungeons? i'm lvl 15 with 47 points in stealth). Should i take stealth later on, or on nm it's useless, becuse of enemys always have more lvl and see stelth than your staelth power?

I played on normal and started seeing things happening at around 100 stealth.

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PostPosted: Sun Feb 21, 2016 6:36 am 
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Low Yeek

Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 10:24 pm
Posts: 7
I managed to win with a Cornac Rogue using Lucky Day and Tricks of the Trade on normal rogulike... it was insanely easy most of the time (well after level 20).

However, I totally regretted getting Lucky Day and Tricks of The Trade. I really don't think these prodigies really did anything meaningful.

When it wasn't easy, it was extremely hard. I think Giant Leap would have been a LOT better. And I also think siding with the merchant might have greatly improved my gear... I ended up doing the Far Portal in my Fortress at least 10 times just to try to get better equipment.... which didn't really net me much of worth.

The entry way to the Prides were very, very hard. I got extremely lucky on a few of them, and in the end I just rushed the door and tried to get out into the main room so I could hide and pick them off slowly.

I killed a LOT of enemies with my sling at 10 spaces as that was pretty safe. Perhaps Tricks of The Trade and Lucky Day helped me do that, I guess.

I got killed once (but had Blood of Life) on one of the High Peak levels as I was trying to kill Zoaumros the Daelach, which was a demon rogue. I couldn't do anything to him really (he had over 9,000 life), and we fought for a long time, but then he managed to kill me in one turn by getting multiple attacks in with some sort of global speed enhancement coupled with slowing me down. He was the only enemy I couldn't defeat and left alone.

I also didn't fight my shade, but I am not even sure where that was... I guess I missed that area.

I was unable to rescue Melinda as I didn't have enough mobility options... Rush would have helped.

The final battle with Argoniel and Elandar was insanely difficult. I had to close the portals, and managed to dig out a spot in one of the columns to hide in. I probably spent about 2 hours fighting them. Multiple times I had to give up and return to my hiding place... once I finally defeated Argoniel I struggled for a very long time with Elandar. Elandar couldn't kill me but I couldn't kill him as he always teleported, and I lacked Rush or Giant Leap. We just ran around playing tag for like 45 minutes.

In the end I won, but it was a lot of luck. I totally regret going for Lucky Day and Tricks of The Trade as those prodigies simply do not help you when the fight goes long...

I took Track by betraying a Anorithil escort and without Track I wouldn't have won. I can honestly say that Track seemed more important to my build than Lucky Day or Tricks of Trade. I can't imagine winning with a rogue without Track. By far the most used non-combat skill that I had.

Here is the link to my character...

http://te4.org/characters/188882/tome/d74516b0-a618-4348-bb7d-921a84bfa550

I might try again as a rogue and use Giant Leap and something else this time... just to see if my complaints about the uselessness of Tricks of The Trade and Lucky Day were accurate or if maybe I just didn't know what I was doing...

I loved playing the rogue. It was tense being so vulnerable, and Hide In Plain Sight was by far the most important skill. It saved me time and time again. Amazingly useful that it makes the enemies forget about you!

Anyway, have fun


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 05, 2016 3:46 pm 
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Halfling

Joined: Fri Jan 01, 2016 2:23 pm
Posts: 107
deplore wrote:
This was my exact build for my lvl 50 skeleton rogue winner, Earefast (won on normal/roguelike): http://te4.org/characters/11707/tome/26468838-b50b-4ec8-a2e0-c57e63ef935b

I put a category point into stealth, got tricks of the trade prodigy, and wore Death's Embrace for an additional +0.10 stealth mastery. So I ended up with 1.80 stealth mastery and unseen actions granting 91% chance to not break stealth. That plus over 45 luck from lucky day prodigy, alchemist potion, and other equips gave me 100+% chance to not break, aside from the breaks generated from failing the checks on melee attacks. I prioritized cunning and stealth bonus to prevent those though, and ended the game with over 140 stealth score.

This build absolutely dominates the endgame. I basically ran though all of the prides and High Peak with impunity, killing 5k-10k hp bosses and uniques with just a couple talents and almost never breaking stealth. By abusing Eden's Guile + Momentum I killed both of the endgame bosses in less than 7 turns. This build is totally viable, even overpowered, the only challenge is getting past the early and mid game. I only died once (used lvl 5 Skeleton Reassemble to resurrect), and that was 100% avoidable. I was drawing the OP drakes out of Vor's armory using an item's range 10 spell beam and accidentally used the rush talent, resulting in my immediate demise.

Thanks for the build! This is pretty much exactly what I was trying to do with a rogue, but mostly tried halflings and thalores with which I didn't have much luck in midgame.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2016 9:57 am 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
Posts: 2263
hmmm, i like the look of this. I never play rogues, but you've inspired me!

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