ToME: the Tales of Maj'Eyal

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 24, 2016 6:39 pm 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
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Ring of the War Master needs to be updated with new techniques for Marksman talents

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:12 am 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

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I got my first ever lua error with this addon, but only after I started using the new slow addon by nsrr. here is the link to the topic where I posted about it:

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=47107&p=220605#p220605

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 12:43 pm 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

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jenx wrote:
I got my first ever lua error with this addon, but only after I started using the new slow addon by nsrr. here is the link to the topic where I posted about it:

viewtopic.php?f=50&t=47107&p=220605#p220605


ok, so nsrr looked at the error and he thinks it is a marksman error. he replied:

Quote:
As for that error, I can't see anything that Slow Tweak would have to do with it. Judging from the code, I think it's fairly likely that is an edge case error. The talent that fired the error was Volley, and it looks like it builds a list of secondary targets and then attacks them one at a time. It doesn't check to see if they are still alive, though, so it could throw an error like this if one of the secondary targets was killed by on-hit burst damage from the Volley attack made against another target within the burst range. I could be wrong about the exact cause, but either way, I'm pretty confident this is all Marksman. Could you post the error in the Marksman thread so Razakai can take a look?


the error is:

Code:
error = "Lua Error: /engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:279: /engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:256: /engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:150: /data-marksman/talents/techniques/archery-prowess_raz.lua:187: attempt to index local 'target' (a nil value)\
stack traceback:\
\9/data-marksman/talents/techniques/archery-prowess_raz.lua:187: in function </data-marksman/talents/techniques/archery-prowess_raz.lua:146>\
\9[C]: in function 'xpcall'\
\9/engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:147: in function </engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:140>\
  At [C]:-1 \
  At [C]:-1 error\
  At /engine/interface/ActorTalents.lua:279 useTalent\
  At /engine/interface/PlayerHotkeys.lua:170 \
  At /engine/interface/PlayerHotkeys.lua:162 activateHotkey\
  At /engine/HotkeysIconsDisplay.lua:384 onMouse\
  At /mod/class/uiset/Minimalist.lua:1785 fct\
  At /engine/Mouse.lua:58 "
seen = true
reported = true

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2017 3:24 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 3:45 pm
Posts: 763
Been a bit busy over xmas - but I am reading this and will get around to fixing them when I can, thanks for the bug reports.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 10:42 am 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
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Question 1: does first blood cause bleeding when
(a) a npc is marked and/or
(b) a npc is over 90% health and/or
(c) every time steady shot is used and/or
(d) every time (vanilla) shoot is used and/or
(e) every time a marksman shoot talent is used?

The bleeding damage is accumulating, which is great, I just can't work out the mechanics.

Question 2: does leeching poison give you XX% healing of all damage, as in all, or just the poison damage, or just....? I'm getting great healing at high levels, and again, would like to understand the mechanics better.

Question 3: so the ole' favourite Snipe - is the idea that this is a one turn shield + 75% vital shot (without the slow buff), given that it grants such high resists etc for one turn and then a 300% shot?

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:19 am 
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Uruivellas

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Should prob make that clearer. Both the guaranteed mark+the bleed triggers only on a hit above 90% life - so generally this will be the first shot you get off a mob. Although some big bosses you may get more than 1 proc. And yes, only works with Steady Shot and Shoot (the basic one).

Leeching poison is a straight life leech - so while the debuff is up, you heal for x% of ALL damage you deal to that target, bit like the Sun Paladin Mark of Light talent. So it's quite a lot of healing.

Yep, it's a bit like blocking. Use the talent and get a significant damage reduction for 1 turn, then the next turn you get a super shot. So while it takes 2 turns to fully use, for 1 of those turns you're negating a lot of incoming damage. The theme/flavour is that you spend 1 turn focusing and aiming (focusing so hard you just ignore the pain of attacks against you) then next turn can fire.


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PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 12:35 pm 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
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Razakai wrote:
Should prob make that clearer. Both the guaranteed mark+the bleed triggers only on a hit above 90% life - so generally this will be the first shot you get off a mob. Although some big bosses you may get more than 1 proc. And yes, only works with Steady Shot and Shoot (the basic one).

Leeching poison is a straight life leech - so while the debuff is up, you heal for x% of ALL damage you deal to that target, bit like the Sun Paladin Mark of Light talent. So it's quite a lot of healing.

Yep, it's a bit like blocking. Use the talent and get a significant damage reduction for 1 turn, then the next turn you get a super shot. So while it takes 2 turns to fully use, for 1 of those turns you're negating a lot of incoming damage. The theme/flavour is that you spend 1 turn focusing and aiming (focusing so hard you just ignore the pain of attacks against you) then next turn can fire.


ok, that's very helpful. it explains why I am sometimes getting 8,000k healing ! pity I can't store it for the following turns :-D (unless of course you make this a feature !!)

I'll have another look at Snipe to see what I think...

The rest of the class is brilliant, every talent adds something important.

btw, if you shoot flare, it's always instant (which I like), and the hits against marked npcs also seem to be (close to) instant. volley certainly is. Is this intended?

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 3:32 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 3:45 pm
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v1.3:
http://te4.org/node/6693

Lots of bugfixes, clarified some tooltips, slightly nerfed Bullseye via giving it a cooldown, dropped the stamina gained by First Blood. I couldn't replicate that lua error with Volley unfortunately - I put some sanity checks in that should hopefully make it no longer occur.


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 10:40 pm 
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Yeek

Joined: Wed Sep 21, 2011 8:53 pm
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Just beat Normal with Marksman, going to give my 2 cents. Went with bows. Overall, I found the class to be well designed. However, there were a few issues.

1. The gameplay of marking was fun, but I noticed that marks didn't work on some bosses (like the final one), making my damage much lower when I needed it the most. Even worse, I now had no stamina sustain other than my equips. I thought it was odd that this class didn't have access to Combat Veteran unlocked. It could really use the passive stamina regen. Although I know that there are already a lot of trees, but I'd suggest placing Combat Techniques as locked instead.

2. The bow tree was underwhelming. The concealment mechanic just didn't do much for me, especially since I put vision skills like Track on auto-use while exploring, which turns off concealment. Even when it worked, it didn't seem to do much. Smoke screen skill was just a poor man's flare, and not really needed. I get the point of Snipe, but I hated using it, and at only 1 point, there wasn't much use for it. The only real use I got out of the tree was Aim, which doesn't hold a candle to the vanilla Aim skill.

3. The munitions tree was good, but it needs visual representation. There's no catharsis to using flaming shots if you can't see a fireball with every hit.

4. I'd almost say that there's too much utility. If felt like playing an Archmage almost, with how much mobility and defensive talents you have. That's basically a way of saying that the class is a touch too strong.

Overall I'd say its in a much better place than Archer, and I would play it again. I went Cornac to be able to pick all the trees, but if I played it again I'd pick another race and skip the bow tree even if using bows.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 11:40 am 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 3:45 pm
Posts: 763
1) Was this against the Sher'tul priest? I didn't think about how Spine of the World might interact with the mark. Might make the mark an other type debuff instead.

2) Yeah I'm still not that happy with Sniper as compared to Munitions or Agility. But not sure about what to do with it just yet.

3) I did have the fireflash graphic in during the first version - and it was pretty obnoxious. Maybe there's a less intrusive fire explosion that could be used for this.

4) It's intended to be a pretty top tier class, but once it goes into 1.5 there will still be a fair few weaknesses for them (some stuff they have in terms of generics is a bit weaker among other things). As long as it's not chronomancer/archmage tier that's good enough for me.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:08 pm 
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Wyrmic

Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:41 pm
Posts: 283
Razakai wrote:
1) Was this against the Sher'tul priest? I didn't think about how Spine of the World might interact with the mark. Might make the mark an other type debuff instead.

The Track debuff also doesn't work against debuff immune creatures which is kinda annoying :D It also feels weird.

Usually, I wouldn't worry too much about that, but without mark, I don't think you have any stamina management possible and the class talents eat stamina fast.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 12:12 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 3:45 pm
Posts: 763
Yeah Mark needs to work vs absolutely anything as it's like combo points, not being able to mark targets cuts off all your stamina regen and like 1/2 your damage.


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 2:06 pm 
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Wyrmic

Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2015 1:41 pm
Posts: 283
I think the speed at which the player drains his own stamina, and how it costs you mroe stamina to regen it makes it a little cumbersome.

Of course I guess a good player won't be annoyed by that too much but it's super easy to find yourself on no stamina making it nearly impossible to regen some since the Mark chance for regular shots is so horrible. Original archer had "relaxed shot" which worked no matter what and only used a cooldown really which was neat. Maybe it Flare didn't cost stamina?

Of course, I guess it's more of a player mistake really so maybe that's for them to track their remaining stamina better. On the other hand, I feel like most classes with ressources have a way to make more of them that doesn't stop working once they are at 0. Between Manasurge runes, Disruption Shield, Bloodcasting etc...


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PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 3:00 pm 
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Uruivellas

Joined: Tue May 14, 2013 3:45 pm
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You do have Escape. That restores 40ish stamina at TL1, scaling up to more. Although it also acts as a defensive option so might be on cooldown - the intent is that when you're using it, it's probably after you've been fighting a few turns and spent some stamina though.

Making Flare free or even cheaper is an idea though, especially as First Blood's stamina regen is less than the old massive amount.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:31 am 
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Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
Posts: 2242
Razakai wrote:
v1.3:
http://te4.org/node/6693

Lots of bugfixes, clarified some tooltips, slightly nerfed Bullseye via giving it a cooldown, dropped the stamina gained by First Blood. I couldn't replicate that lua error with Volley unfortunately - I put some sanity checks in that should hopefully make it no longer occur.


Bullseye was fine :-(

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