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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:30 am 
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Spiderkin

Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:47 pm
Posts: 573
The description of reflex defense is incoherent with its action.

Code:
newTalent{
        name = "Reflex Defense",
        type = {"technique/unarmed-training", 4},
        require = techs_cun_req4,
        points = 5,
        mode = "passive",
        getFlatReduction = function(self, t) return self:combatTalentScale(t, 30, 70, 0.75) end,
        critResist = function(self, t) return self:combatTalentScale(t, 8, 25, 0.75) end,
        passives = function(self, t, p)
                self:talentTemporaryValue(p, "ignore_direct_crits", t.critResist(self, t))
        end,
        info = function(self, t)
                return ([[Your understanding of physiology allows you to apply your reflexes in new ways, increasing the flat damage reduction granted by Striking Stance by %d%% and causing direct critical hits (physical, mental, spells) against you to have a %d%% lower Critical multiplier (but always do at least normal damage).]]):
                format(t.getFlatReduction(self,t), t.critResist(self,t) )
        end
}


"ignore_direct-crits" reduces the probability to be critted, not the critical multiplier AFAIK. Either the description or the action should be updated.


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 10:35 am 
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Thalore

Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 10:28 pm
Posts: 148
Same thing with danger sense, it doesn't actually do what the description says


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 11:46 am 
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Wyrmic

Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:20 am
Posts: 251
the same thing is also an issue with indiscernible anatomy, ice body, the doomelf racial, and pretty much every other talent in the entire game that claims to reduce critical damage taken, and every item that claims to reduce critical damage taken including ablative armor
maybe they'd oughta just change the mechanics of critshrug to reduce critmult against you to a 100% minimum instead of giving a chance to shrug off critical hits against you, which in my opinion seems VERY powerful if you manage to hit 100%(oozemancer, alchemist, any doomelf with ablative armor >67? dex and a 15% critshrug rare item)


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 18, 2017 3:10 pm 
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Spiderkin

Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 7:47 pm
Posts: 573
Quote:
maybe they'd oughta just change the mechanics of critshrug to reduce critmult against you to a 100% minimum instead of giving a chance to shrug off critical hits against you, which in my opinion seems VERY powerful if you manage to hit 100%(oozemancer, alchemist, any doomelf with ablative armor >67? dex and a 15% critshrug rare item)


Indeed, both mechanism already exist in the game. They are both displayed in the char screen (Crit reduction (reduces crit mult) and Crit shrug off (reduces chance to be critted).
And points in "Reflex Defense" correctly (according to the code) appear in "Crit shrug off".

What is extremely perturbing is that descriptions are completely scrambled.

For instance "heavy armor training" **is** a crit reduction and properly appear as such in the char reduction, while its descriptions states:
Code:
                return ([[You become better at using your armour to deflect blows and protect your vital areas. Increases Armour value by %d, Armour hardiness by %d%%, and reduces the chance melee or ranged attacks critically hit you by %d%% with your current body armour.

Obvioulsy the description should say 'and reduces the crit multiplier of melee or ranged attacks against you by %d%%'

These obviously incorrect descriptions should be modified:

- Survival/Danger Sense: correct
- Ooze/Indicernible anatomy: incorrect
- Frost Alchemy/Ice Core: incorrect
- Chronomancy/foresight: correct
- Necrosis/Lichform: correct

But maybe there are some others.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:24 pm 
Offline
Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
Posts: 2245
ghostbuster wrote:
The description of reflex defense is incoherent with its action.

Code:
newTalent{
        name = "Reflex Defense",
        type = {"technique/unarmed-training", 4},
        require = techs_cun_req4,
        points = 5,
        mode = "passive",
        getFlatReduction = function(self, t) return self:combatTalentScale(t, 30, 70, 0.75) end,
        critResist = function(self, t) return self:combatTalentScale(t, 8, 25, 0.75) end,
        passives = function(self, t, p)
                self:talentTemporaryValue(p, "ignore_direct_crits", t.critResist(self, t))
        end,
        info = function(self, t)
                return ([[Your understanding of physiology allows you to apply your reflexes in new ways, increasing the flat damage reduction granted by Striking Stance by %d%% and causing direct critical hits (physical, mental, spells) against you to have a %d%% lower Critical multiplier (but always do at least normal damage).]]):
                format(t.getFlatReduction(self,t), t.critResist(self,t) )
        end
}


"ignore_direct-crits" reduces the probability to be critted, not the critical multiplier AFAIK. Either the description or the action should be updated.


That's not correct. When ignore_direct_crits is called, crit damage has already been factored in. What this does is give you a percent chance to remove the crit damage altogether, effectively reversing the calculation. So the description in Foresight is correct where it says "a chance to shrug off critical damage..."

What Reflex Defence should say is "causing direct critical hits (physical, mental, spells) against you to have a %d%% chance to remove Critical damage (but always do at least normal damage)."

And it should be Defence not Defense btw.

The reason this subtle distinction is important is, certain effects, like elemental surge, still trigger, because it was a critical hit, even though the actual damage done is reversed.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 7:32 pm 
Offline
Sher'Tul Godslayer

Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:16 pm
Posts: 2245
ghostbuster wrote:
Quote:
maybe they'd oughta just change the mechanics of critshrug to reduce critmult against you to a 100% minimum instead of giving a chance to shrug off critical hits against you, which in my opinion seems VERY powerful if you manage to hit 100%(oozemancer, alchemist, any doomelf with ablative armor >67? dex and a 15% critshrug rare item)


Indeed, both mechanism already exist in the game. They are both displayed in the char screen (Crit reduction (reduces crit mult) and Crit shrug off (reduces chance to be critted).
And points in "Reflex Defense" correctly (according to the code) appear in "Crit shrug off".

What is extremely perturbing is that descriptions are completely scrambled.

For instance "heavy armor training" **is** a crit reduction and properly appear as such in the char reduction, while its descriptions states:
Code:
                return ([[You become better at using your armour to deflect blows and protect your vital areas. Increases Armour value by %d, Armour hardiness by %d%%, and reduces the chance melee or ranged attacks critically hit you by %d%% with your current body armour.

Obvioulsy the description should say 'and reduces the crit multiplier of melee or ranged attacks against you by %d%%'

These obviously incorrect descriptions should be modified:

- Survival/Danger Sense: correct
- Ooze/Indicernible anatomy: incorrect
- Frost Alchemy/Ice Core: incorrect
- Chronomancy/foresight: correct
- Necrosis/Lichform: correct

But maybe there are some others.


Armour is corectly described, but like Reflex Defence, Indiscernible Anatomy and Ice Core should be changed, as per my previous post.

_________________
MADNESS rocks


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