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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:21 am 
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Halfling

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 8:03 pm
Posts: 96
Or at least worthy of consideration... as far as I know nobody, ever, for any reason whatsoever puts more than 1 point in anything besides undead T1 racials. So I suggest a slight buff, so they don't get instant 5/5's, but at least give some value from investment. Ideally they won't make the original effect strictly better, rather add some more effects to it, possibly ones that might complement certain builds. Some ideas I had:

Higher:
At talent level 2 cancel one bleed/cut each turn the regen is in effect / alt. make a check to cancel, but effective during regen from any source
T3 - poisons
T5 - diseases

Yeek: Allow higher priority targets (possibly at reduced mindpower, though why the heck, Necro's is permanent and I don't see that getting him out the poor house) and/or increase duration. I know that contradicts with what I said about making the original effect better, but that's all I can think of right now.

[sorry, gotta run, will wrap this up later, please post any ideas you might have, also for higher level racials like Wayist and Thalore summons, what could be done that is not better summons/increased duration whilst giving some value and fits the theme?]


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:51 am 
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Archmage

Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:46 pm
Posts: 303
I will almost always put points in Doomelf t1 racial.
Sometimes Halfling as well.

I do agree with giving a bit more incentive to leveling t1 racials, but NOT add new effects based on level, new effect you feel "forced" to spend the points for them, while better numbers is much more of a choice

Yeek and Thalore summons are REALLY strong, please do not buff them. Right now their talent levels scale on the racial talent level, what more do you want?

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 11:41 am 
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Halfling

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 8:03 pm
Posts: 96
That's exactly why I thought effects would be better, since you'll only level up if you needed the additional effects, while you still get the best digits from the initial ones without further investment, tough I admit I am a slave to numbers and when I want a certain talent I fell obliged to get the most of it, even if it's a measly few percent (which is obviously not the best way to play). As I said I was thinking of something very niche, that only certain builds would want to invest in.

And now that I think about it my suggestions don't really satisfy this rule, the Higher one for example seems to get universally better for everyone regardless of build. Then again you have other ways to fight those effects, but still probably only generic starved classes would want to skip it. See, I'm not very good at the game (love it though, every cruciating death) so It's kind of hard for me to weight those things one against other. I'll try giving it more thought.

PS. You level Haste\Luck for shorter cooldowns = more frequent uses, right?


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:33 pm 
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Wyrmic

Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 3:20 am
Posts: 287
theres plenty of racials that are worth sticking more than 1 point into, or even 5/5ing

bone armor
reassemble
ghoulish leap
retch
stoneskin
power is money
duck'n'dodge, if you want more evasion uptime
maybe militant mind
unity
quickened
guardian of the wood
magic of the eternals
timeless
grisly constitution
writ large
maybe overseer of nations
born into magic
resilience of the doomed
pitiless

and alot of EoR racials

EDIT: actually, now I'm not so sure if this is about just T1 racials or all racials


Last edited by Zeyphor on Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:49 pm 
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Archmage

Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:46 pm
Posts: 303
oh wow this was about all racials?

I really misunderstood, thought it was about T1 ones LOL

then yeah, there is a lot of racials you sometimes/always want to 5/5, obviously

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 8:59 am 
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Halfling

Joined: Sun Sep 29, 2013 8:03 pm
Posts: 96
It's about all racials that are conventional one-pointers, most of which are T1 accidentally (or not so much?). Also stuff like Shalore T3, which is pretty much a tax point. I know Shalore are great enough already, but still I don like useless talents. I mentioned the Yeek/Thalore summons since the only thing that improves with investment is cooldowns so most people tend to leave them at one point. I mean, weather is 50 or 20 turns cooldown, you've either won the encounter or have fled, so who cares if you're gonna wait 50 or 20 turns?


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:23 am 
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Archmage

Joined: Wed Jan 22, 2014 1:46 pm
Posts: 303
The summons scale with talent level and are strong as it is, i'll say it again, they do not need a buff.

More than half the racials are worth 5/5ing, depending on how many generics you can spare.
Halfling : all good at 1 but all GREAT at 5
Doomelf : all but 3rd worth 5/5
Shalore : all but 3rd
Thalore : all but 2nd
Ogre : 2nd and 4th
Dwarf : 3rd, possibly 2nd and 1st (at least 2/5 in 2nd)
Higher : 2nd, possibly 3rd or 4th (the problem here is that you're playing Higher)
Yeek : 3rd and 4th, at least 2-3 in 2nd
Undead : all except maybe 1st

More than half are always worth 5/5 imo (in a vacuum, depends against what they compete in the end) and a few are debatable.
Rather than give new benefits with levels, let's make the unwanted racials wanted in the first place (and also nerf some others). We do not need every race to require 20 gen points to be appealing however.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:59 am 
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Sher'Tul

Joined: Wed May 22, 2013 2:39 am
Posts: 1280
Location: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
To be honest, most of the tier 1 racial talents right now are pretty fine as is. Cooldown isn't important right away in the game since most fights don't last too long, but later on it can be nice to reduce the cooldowns on them. Most of the tier 4 racial talents are also pretty good - with the exception of maybe Timeless still being quite strong compared to the rest of them.

The tier 2 and 3 racial talents are... thematic. They tell you a lot of the distinct qualities of the different races and some of them can be useful to invest in; though sometimes they can be a bit niche and that might make them less useful. I don't necessarily think they should be changed around too much, just looked at to make sure that they can at least appeal to a good variety of builds in some form.

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 5:18 am 
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Wyrmic

Joined: Fri Oct 09, 2015 2:27 pm
Posts: 227
Doomelf and Undeads have always been worth it to me with tier 1. Putting points in Shalore has occured to me before, because who wouldn't be interested in reducing the cooldown of Blinding Speed (even though Grace already has a lower cooldown)?


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