Is this supposed to be impossibly hard?

[deathknight1728]

I dont know if this is me, but I am having a heck of a time with just defeating enemies that are tough. Golems/trolls are impossible for a lvl 2 rogue and there really isnt ANY strategy involved in a low lvl character. My tactics are usually to destroy any enemy with dirty fighting and attacking until dead. The BIG/TOUGH guys have some bit of strategy where I attack them with DFighting and hit them a few times, then regroup as they are slowed and by then I have healed myself back to full.

The problem is that groups are brutal. I dont know, maybe the tactics in the game isnt until a later level. Ive played similar rpgs like Eschalon series and I could figure them out, but this game eludes me.

1-Am I supposed to have problems with groups at this lvl?

2-Arent there areas with respawning enemies to exp farm?

[Crim, The Red Thunder]

The only areas with 'respawning' enemies is the worldmap (adventurer parties) which is QUITE dangerous to farm, and farportals later on (which always come with a boss, it's only a matter of time until it finds some combination that screws you). You aren't supposed to farm.

And part of dealing with a rogue (which I'm admittedly not expert with) is learning how to split groups up. (Stealth can help with this.)

And rogue's also aren't the easiest class to play either.

[XLambda]

Rogues require an extremely focused and careful style of playing. Especially early on, when each point you get counts.

I usually try to get a point in Dagger Mastery as fast as possible, followed by a point in Accuracy. As for class talents, get the two stunners. And never be afraid to run away, and reposition yourself where only one enemy can hit you. Put stealth on autouse, it's not very good early on but it might keep some enemies away from you when you really can't handle them. Don't forget to use your defensive talents on time. I normally avoid traps (I actually don't know whether they are any good).

Even with a good strategy and optimal early build, you're still going to have a hard time. Rogues have probably one of the hardest - if not the hardest - start. For starters, I can't really recommend them.

[SageAcrin]

Good rule of thumb;

Don't fight world map enemies.

You can certainly try to figure out when and where to fight world map enemies-there's a lot of rules of thumb, they follow certain guidelines, some classes are much better against them than the others(world map enemies tend to have no classes of status resistance, for example, as they stand now, so large area status will do well there.).

But if you don't want to do a lot of puzzling and want to understand the game in general? Don't fight them and do dungeons instead. This will give you a more gradual ease into combat.

And yeah, Rogues aren't easy. You picked one of the hardest classes to start with. Try another!

[Noel]

Another early tip - always assume that seeing a single enemy is a scout for an unseen horde. Draw 'em into a defensible place, and then wait for the rest.

If the rest don't show up, smile and explore some more.

[Edit]
Oh, and don't be afraid to emulate Brave Sir Robin! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZwuTo7zKM8

[jotwebe]

I dont know if this is me, but I am having a heck of a time with just defeating enemies that are tough. Golems/trolls are impossible for a lvl 2 rogue and there really isnt ANY strategy involved in a low lvl character. My tactics are usually to destroy any enemy with dirty fighting and attacking until dead. The BIG/TOUGH guys have some bit of strategy where I attack them with DFighting and hit them a few times, then regroup as they are slowed and by then I have healed myself back to full.

The problem is that groups are brutal. I dont know, maybe the tactics in the game isnt until a later level. Ive played similar rpgs like Eschalon series and I could figure them out, but this game eludes me.

1-Am I supposed to have problems with groups at this lvl?

2-Arent there areas with respawning enemies to exp farm?

Yes, it's supposed to be that hard. ToME is a roguelike with RPG influences, not the other way around. Dying a lot is part of doing business. There are some youtube videos around, and here's a recent series of someone playing a dwarf berserker not too badly: http://forums.te4.org/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=37927

Rogues are difficult, but they're also an opportunity to learn. Some general advice:

* be cautious: look for bottlenecks and lure enemies there, retreat into known territory as soon as you see enemies so you don't run into their friends, if you meet ranged, duck behind a corner
* always rest up before exploring, that includes cooldowns
* when things become dangerous, slow down, take your time, think. This was hard for me to learn back when I started playing roguelikes, but it helps a lot. It's counter-intuitive though.
* use your regen infusion just before you start taking damage (it will take 1 turn)
* if your opponent can stun, freeze, or pin you, don't use your wild infusion right away, otherwise do (it won't take any time)
* keep an eye on your status effects (right side below the minimap), remember to use your wild infusion to clear bad ones
* recognise when things go south, and run away. I am still trying to learn this myself.

I normally avoid traps (I actually don't know whether they are any good).

Traps are pretty powerful early, the explosion one is kinda tricky to use since it explodes with radius 2, but the beartrap is straitforward, pins and causes bleeding. I remember hearing they don't scale too well for higher levels, but that was ages (and several patches) ago, and anyway it won't be an issue for the OP.

[donkatsu]

Weapon damage in general starts off quite low, but scales slightly better than spell damage. When you're doing like 30 damage per attack at level 2 as a rogue (assuming you even pass the accuracy check), you'll be doing like 100 as any caster. At range. For an easier early game, try going with a caster class, such as alchemist. Or you could focus more on rogue traps, which scale sort of like spells.

[Earwicker]

Also, check the fletcher in Last Hope, he sometimes sells good slings and you might be lucky. As a Rogue I've seen him offer one of the range 10 artifact slings, twice. Hard to resist buying and using these while you build up your stealth and melee damage, and learning basic Shoot costs only 8 gold.

[HousePet]

Where are you going?

And are you trying the same thing repeatedly?

(I can't get anywhere with rogues either)

[BoomFrog]

Most has been said already, but traps are amazingly strong for a rogue early. 2 points for bear trap is worth it. I 5/5 traps ASAP and ride that to midgame at least, but I haven't won the game as a rogue yet so take it with a grain of salt.

Anyway the point is that, yes strategy or actually tactics start from level 1. You should be able to avoid fighting groups almost entirely with good positioning. You should be fighting them one at a time in a line.

[wobbly]

I usually try to get a point in Dagger Mastery as fast as possible, followed by a point in Accuracy. As for class talents, get the two stunners. And never be afraid to run away, and reposition yourself where only one enemy can hit you. Put stealth on autouse, it's not very good early on but it might keep some enemies away from you when you really can't handle them. Don't forget to use your defensive talents on time. I normally avoid traps (I actually don't know whether they are any good).

I play similarly except accuracy before dagger mastery. It's worth noting that your stun talents( dual strike & dirty fighting) work of accuracy. Keep your accuracy at least 20 higher then opponents physical saves to guarantee a stun (against non- stun immune - go to inspect creature, defense tab to check if they have stun resistance). Have you been stunned yet? I bet you have. Annoying? It does the same thing to the enemy, get yours in first.

[greycat]

Golems/trolls are impossible for a lvl 2 rogue

I'm a bit concerned by this part -- how are you fighting golems at level 2? Maybe you stumbled across a "rare" pseudo-boss monster somewhere, and it happened to be an Alchemist. If that's the case, then you either had really bad luck, or you went somewhere you shouldn't have tried to go just yet. (Or you got ambushed by an adventurer party on the world map, which is just plain death at your level.)

Basic rogue strategy: survive. When you beat your first boss (Prox or Norgos) you'll be level 4 or 5, and then you can start to see some real damage output from your daggers. Do the Arena quest in Derth for 2 generic points, and avoid the tough areas until you're higher level.

Build Dexterity, Cunning and Constitution (in roughly that order).

Rogues are highly dependent on finding good stuff. Better daggers, armor, rings, amulets, belts, and regeneration infusions are critical. It's worth shopping for regen infusions after the first dungeon, if you have enough gold to buy one, and if you didn't already get a good one by luck.

[imsabbel]

He might be starting a skeleton rogue. That would about fit - you will still be lvl 2 when encountering the boss at the end of the dungeon.

Which is basically impossible right now. It took me 9 characters to make it out the starter dungeon the last time I tried, and even then I never beat the boss and just slipped out to the world map.

[SageAcrin]

It's possible-I did it a few versions back.

You pretty much have to either temporarily spec to or permanently build some traps to do it, though. Just drop a trap and lead him through it, repeat, he can't keep up with you thanks to Phase Door.

Managing to not attrition die can be annoying, but he can't heal and you can, so...

Regardless, though, in spirit you're right; It's a pretty hard thing for a new player to do.

(Then again it's pretty hard for a new player to have Skeleton, generally speaking...)

[achoice]

Good rule of thumb; Don't fight world map enemies.

I second that. Wait until you are lvl 40+ and then confront those bastards. They are not that tough then! Sweet vengeance!